“Vaccination continues to be a very safe and effective way to protect against serious illness or death following infection with COVID-19. Across the world billions of doses of COVID-19 messenger RNA vaccines have been administered and are considered to have saved millions of lives. The findings in this study do not suggest that these frameshift mistakes are harmful to the body, nor do they suggest they are associated with the very rare adverse reactions to the vaccines that some people have experience such as myocarditis. By showing how these frameshift mistakes can prevented this provides an excellent opportunity to increase the efficacy of the mRNA vaccines and further improve their safety profile.” Prof Neil Mabbott, Personal Chair in Immunopathology and Head of Immunology Division, The Roslin Institute & Royal (Dick) School of Veterinary Sciences , University of Edinburgh, said:
别听楼主耸人听闻胡言夸张。 Pfizer 疫苗仍然有效未减，如同打敌人没有100%地正打在心脏中央上，打偏一点点而已，仍然产生所需的免疫反应。Both ChAdOx1 nCoV-19 and BNT162b2 vaccination produced ELISpot responses to in-frame SARS-CoV-2 spike。该文的作用是，今后该疫苗有改进的余地，会做得更好。这是任何新事物的规律，产品一代比一代好而已。
USA 🇺🇲 Wow, The Insanity Continues 🔥Navy Medical Officer reveals Covax Vaccine Related Heart Issues. These numbers are astounding. "Myocarditis up 151%, Ischemic heart disease up 69%, pulmonary heart disease up 62% and Heart Failure is up 973% 👀👇 pic.twitter.com/KoPb82uUbr — 𝙍𝙄𝙎𝙀𝙈𝙀𝙇𝘽𝙊𝙐𝙍𝙉𝙀 (@Risemelbourne) November 28, 2023
USA 🇺🇲 Wow, The Insanity Continues 🔥Navy Medical Officer reveals Covax Vaccine Related Heart Issues. These numbers are astounding. "Myocarditis up 151%, Ischemic heart disease up 69%, pulmonary heart disease up 62% and Heart Failure is up 973% 👀👇 pic.twitter.com/KoPb82uUbr — 𝙍𝙄𝙎𝙀𝙈𝙀𝙇𝘽𝙊𝙐𝙍𝙉𝙀 (@Risemelbourne) November 28, 2023
没看到这里？市面上的mRNA疫苗都有这个N1甲基化 clinically approved SARS-CoV-2 mRNA vaccines incorporate N1-methylpseudouridine (1-methylΨ), which has been shown to decrease IVT mRNA innate immunogenicity3,4,5.
“their experiments, roughly 8% of the proteins produced from their experimental mRNAs were frameshifted. To test whether the same effect happens in the body, the team compared the immune reactions of mice that were vaccinated either with the COVID-19 mRNA vaccine made by Pfizer or with a less widely used DNA-based vaccine from AstraZeneca. They found that the Pfizer-vaccinated mice generated antibodies to frameshift-derived proteins, whereas animals vaccinated with the AstraZeneca vaccine did not.” science.org 上有个文章讲这个, 貌似是虽然有缺陷，但是Pfizer 疫苗还是产生了抗体。实验里也就是8%的出现错误。任何东西都是有误差的，但是不太影响结果。这文章对以后改进有帮助
这里有篇Science 简报，更适合普通读者。 摘要两段： 我个人对immune response broadening 的看法存疑。 link 如下 The researchers found that mRNAs containing the form of pseudouridine used in Pfizer’s and Moderna’s COVID-19 vaccines were much more likely to induce frameshifted proteins than mRNAs with normal uridines. In their experiments, roughly 8% of the proteins produced from their experimental mRNAs were frameshifted. The Cambridge team emphasized at a press briefing that its work doesn’t indicate COVID-19 vaccines are unsafe. Indeed, Karikó notes that frameshifts frequently occur naturally when infected cells make viral proteins. These frameshifted proteins can naturally broaden the body’s immune response, she says, so it’s possible that the spike-targeting COVID-19 vaccines may even get a boost from the misreading. When asked about the new paper, Pfizer did not directly comment on its findings but in a statement said its vaccines had a “positive benefit-risk profile.” A Moderna spokesperson declined to comment. https://www.science.org/content/article/mrna-vaccines-may-make-unintended-proteins-there-s-no-evidence-harm#:~:text=The%20researchers%20found%20that%20mRNAs,their%20experimental%20mRNAs%20were%20frameshifted.
这里有篇Science 简报，更适合普通读者。 摘要两段： 我个人对immune response broadening 的看法存疑。 link 如下 The researchers found that mRNAs containing the form of pseudouridine used in Pfizer’s and Moderna’s COVID-19 vaccines were much more likely to induce frameshifted proteins than mRNAs with normal uridines. In their experiments, roughly 8% of the proteins produced from their experimental mRNAs were frameshifted. The Cambridge team emphasized at a press briefing that its work doesn’t indicate COVID-19 vaccines are unsafe. Indeed, Karikó notes that frameshifts frequently occur naturally when infected cells make viral proteins. These frameshifted proteins can naturally broaden the body’s immune response, she says, so it’s possible that the spike-targeting COVID-19 vaccines may even get a boost from the misreading. When asked about the new paper, Pfizer did not directly comment on its findings but in a statement said its vaccines had a “positive benefit-risk profile.” A Moderna spokesperson declined to comment. https://www.science.org/content/article/mrna-vaccines-may-make-unintended-proteins-there-s-no-evidence-harm#:~:text=The%20researchers%20found%20that%20mRNAs,their%20experimental%20mRNAs%20were%20frameshifted. muyangnv 发表于 2023-12-08 13:42
这里有篇Science 简报，更适合普通读者。 摘要两段： 我个人对immune response broadening 的看法存疑。 link 如下 The researchers found that mRNAs containing the form of pseudouridine used in Pfizer’s and Moderna’s COVID-19 vaccines were much more likely to induce frameshifted proteins than mRNAs with normal uridines. In their experiments, roughly 8% of the proteins produced from their experimental mRNAs were frameshifted. The Cambridge team emphasized at a press briefing that its work doesn’t indicate COVID-19 vaccines are unsafe. Indeed, Karikó notes that frameshifts frequently occur naturally when infected cells make viral proteins. These frameshifted proteins can naturally broaden the body’s immune response, she says, so it’s possible that the spike-targeting COVID-19 vaccines may even get a boost from the misreading. When asked about the new paper, Pfizer did not directly comment on its findings but in a statement said its vaccines had a “positive benefit-risk profile.” A Moderna spokesperson declined to comment. https://www.science.org/content/article/mrna-vaccines-may-make-unintended-proteins-there-s-no-evidence-harm#:~:text=The%20researchers%20found%20that%20mRNAs,their%20experimental%20mRNAs%20were%20frameshifted. muyangnv 发表于 2023-12-08 13:42
正常感染病毒是不太可能会产生mRNA 疫苗的那种+1 frameshift 新肽段。 这里原文作者是有论述的。 这篇文章对今后的mRNA vaccine and therapy 都有很好的指导左右。以后设计mRNA 疫苗，都要test translation fidelity, optimize the RNA sequence to avoid slippery sites. 文章最后一段，作者成功的identify 了两个slippery site, 并且对其进行mutate以后，misreading frameshift 大大降低了。 It is not feasible that these data are a consequence of natural SARS-CoV-2 infection for the following, non-exhaustive, reasons. First, no frameshifting activity is known to occur during SARS-CoV-2 spike subgenomic mRNA translation (which would be a major discovery in its own right). Second, −1 frameshifting (and not +1 frameshifting) is restricted to a single programmed site in ORF1a and ORF1b (ref. 23). Third, +1 frameshifted peptides are predicted from the BNT162b2 mRNA sequence, and not the S gene sequence from wild virus (Extended Data Fig. 4). Instead, these data suggest that vaccination with 1-methylΨ mRNA can elicit cellular immunity to peptide antigens produced by +1 ribosomal frameshifting in both major histocompatibility complex (MHC)-diverse people and MHC-uniform mice.
这里有篇Science 简报，更适合普通读者。 摘要两段： 我个人对immune response broadening 的看法存疑。 link 如下 The researchers found that mRNAs containing the form of pseudouridine used in Pfizer’s and Moderna’s COVID-19 vaccines were much more likely to induce frameshifted proteins than mRNAs with normal uridines. In their experiments, roughly 8% of the proteins produced from their experimental mRNAs were frameshifted. The Cambridge team emphasized at a press briefing that its work doesn’t indicate COVID-19 vaccines are unsafe. Indeed, Karikó notes that frameshifts frequently occur naturally when infected cells make viral proteins. These frameshifted proteins can naturally broaden the body’s immune response, she says, so it’s possible that the spike-targeting COVID-19 vaccines may even get a boost from the misreading. When asked about the new paper, Pfizer did not directly comment on its findings but in a statement said its vaccines had a “positive benefit-risk profile.” A Moderna spokesperson declined to comment. https://www.science.org/content/article/mrna-vaccines-may-make-unintended-proteins-there-s-no-evidence-harm#:~:text=The%20researchers%20found%20that%20mRNAs,their%20experimental%20mRNAs%20were%20frameshifted. muyangnv 发表于 2023-12-08 13:42
...These frameshifted proteins can naturally broaden the body’s immune response... Ins't this exactly the trigger for auto-immune disease?
...These frameshifted proteins can naturally broaden the body’s immune response... Ins't this exactly the trigger for auto-immune disease? WernerCA 发表于 2023-12-08 15:36
我让gpt总结了一下，再翻成中文。我就想请问说的这么惊悚的到底出于什么目的. "Overall, these findings increase the understanding of how modified ribonucleotides affect the fidelity of mRNA translation. While no adverse outcomes from mistranslation of mRNA-based SARS-CoV-2 vaccines in humans have been reported, the study highlights potential off-target effects for future mRNA-based therapeutics and the need for sequence optimization." 这些研究结果增加了我们对修饰过的核糖核苷酸如何影响mRNA翻译的准确性的理解。尽管目前没有报告mRNA基础的SARS-CoV-2疫苗在人体中因翻译错误造成的不良后果，但该研究强调了未来mRNA基础治疗法潜在的非目标效应以及序列优化的需要
回复 1楼大青椒的帖子 新西兰疫苗死亡率的机密数据被新西兰卫生部的一名员工爆料！根据他的分析，特定疫苗批次的接种后死亡人数似乎不成比例，特别是在新西兰南岛，南岛的因弗卡吉尔市报告了30%的接种后死亡率，远高于该国的平均死亡率0.7%！！ Liz Gunn披露51人同一注射点相继死亡. Barry Young 曝光了10个批次的疫苗造成了超高死亡率，其中一个注射点的837次注射导致了253个死亡，近30%死亡率。新西兰政府将其逮捕，并且正在起诉他7年监禁 https://twitter.com/forest_of_shire/status/1731545978820579527 https://rumble.com/v3ynskd-operation-m.o.a.r-mother-of-all-revelations.html
正确的应该是长绿条代表的肽，但是 BNT162b2疫苗产生的都是错误的短肽，图中下面几条。 论文链接： https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-023-06800-3
🔥 最新回帖
确实。做科研的人尤其要humble。强如牛顿，爱因斯坦，对很多东西的认识后来也被证明是错的，何况一般科研者。居高临下一副真理在手的态度确实没有必要。
可以找律师问问可看看能以索赔吗。 幸存者可以尝试联名索赔。
我也是做科研相关的，在免疫方面可能的确不如您这种内行懂得多，但是我不赞成您这种说法。
科学本身就是在不断地修正过去的认知上前进的
任何做科学研究的人都应该知道对待科学最起码的态度是，实事求是而不能很教条的用已有的科学理论去要求事实符合理论
更何况我们应该老老实实的承认covid的病毒是一种前所未见的病毒， mRNA 疫苗也是一种新的剂型和治疗方式，我们对这两者的认知还有待完善，承认一下事实，承认自己的无知并没有什么错
不要过于相信ChatGPT，它的database也只更新到2022年年初
最后不得不改口说不防死亡，只防重症
🛋️ 沙发板凳
😂 笑死
Wiki上说是的
nature 自然杂志，没听过？ 世界顶级
跌了2年，没有position，表示淡定 可能业内2年前就知道了，韭菜们肯定是最后知道的一批
国内的康熙诺和这个是一个疫苗吗？
1. 看不懂: mRNA frame shift 会造成mistranslation 2. 打了之后会有什么可怕后果？so far 没看到adverse outcome，也可能还没report，以后不知道。 3. 哪家的疫苗？：Pfizer
我靠，现在还人打？！
现在打的人多了
RNA变更了不就是癌症吗。任何非正常组织，良性的是肿瘤，恶性的癌症。
。。。打回去重学高中生物
只是 1-methylΨ modification 会增加frameshifting而已
还“都是错误的”？
求科普，完全看不懂！
https://www.science.org/content/article/mrna-vaccines-may-make-unintended-proteins-there-s-no-evidence-harm#:~:text=Messenger%20RNA%20(blue)%20directs%20cells,small%20amounts%20of%20unintended%20proteins.
Prof Neil Mabbott, Personal Chair in Immunopathology and Head of Immunology Division, The Roslin Institute & Royal (Dick) School of Veterinary Sciences , University of Edinburgh, said:
这年头，连RNA是什么都搞不清楚的人，都能特自信地觉得自己很懂疫苗, 觉得自己“独立思考”。
没有足够科学知识的猜测，不叫“独立思考”。
两小儿辩日的两个小朋友，在孔子时代算独立思考的小朋友； 如果在现代，是成年人了，还拒绝学习和承认最基本的astronomy和光学 ，说同样的傻话，那叫“愚昧无知”。
别听楼主耸人听闻胡言夸张。 Pfizer 疫苗仍然有效未减，如同打敌人没有100%地正打在心脏中央上，打偏一点点而已，仍然产生所需的免疫反应。Both ChAdOx1 nCoV-19 and BNT162b2 vaccination produced ELISpot responses to in-frame SARS-CoV-2 spike。该文的作用是，今后该疫苗有改进的余地，会做得更好。这是任何新事物的规律，产品一代比一代好而已。
我的天，我打的就是Pfizer。。。
是你不懂吧？
楼主，是您发现的这是个错误吗？如果是，可不可以去nature 杂志Appeal 或者麻烦再查查，看有没有相关的信息发表出来 关键是我们什么都不懂。 既然您发现了，就看看能不能再做些深入的工作。 谢谢啦
实际的保护率是0吧。都知道是咋回事。政府，pfizer，加诺奖一路忽悠过来。神迹。。。
adverse event太多了。之前斯坦福医院死的那个小中。而且。就是这个疫苗副作用是公开的。只不过公开的都是pdf，没有人愿意处理。关键是谁知道既得利益者怎么黑的呀。你愿意公布事实，搞不好会被人搞死的。
我有朋友下了那些PDF想处理，被我劝阻了。
没看懂，这是P家？
但P家疫苗在现实世界里，确实极大抑制了covid的传播和致死率，这总做不得假。。
容易引发心脏病/血栓等副作用，这我是相信的，身边有不少一手的经验，都是打了疫苗后突然引发血栓
所以在特效药出来后，现在都不建议继续打加强针了
😄。那些动不动就嘲笑别人信阴谋论的人才是真被洗脑了，zf说啥就信啥 ，没有自己独立的思辨能力
前面不是还有人号称”very rare adverse events” LOL 这两年铺天盖地的心肌炎和猝死都忘了，光这个版就有多少心脏不舒服的？月经不调那些都不算个事
pseudoU 就可以了 不知道为什么要用N1 pseudoU
成本高很多
斯坦福医院死的那个小中 是哪个？
我也打的Pfizer，当年说P家比Moderna的副作用小，反正大家都被忽悠自愿或者强制当小白鼠了
没看到这里？市面上的mRNA疫苗都有这个N1甲基化 clinically approved SARS-CoV-2 mRNA vaccines incorporate N1-methylpseudouridine (1-methylΨ), which has been shown to decrease IVT mRNA innate immunogenicity3,4,5.
当初这里劝阻不要打疫苗的， 被骂说是因为疫苗数量有限， 劝阻别人不要打疫苗是为了自己可以优先打到
两行字居然没说出半句正确的，也是服了
这篇论文两年前说，用这个是为了增加疫苗效率，结果这么乌龙！
To test whether the same effect happens in the body, the team compared the immune reactions of mice that were vaccinated either with the COVID-19 mRNA vaccine made by Pfizer or with a less widely used DNA-based vaccine from AstraZeneca. They found that the Pfizer-vaccinated mice generated antibodies to frameshift-derived proteins, whereas animals vaccinated with the AstraZeneca vaccine did not.” science.org 上有个文章讲这个, 貌似是虽然有缺陷，但是Pfizer 疫苗还是产生了抗体。实验里也就是8%的出现错误。任何东西都是有误差的，但是不太影响结果。这文章对以后改进有帮助
这些抗体都是针对已经过时的病毒的抗体，没有任何一款疫苗产生的抗体是针对正在流行的病毒。
The researchers found that mRNAs containing the form of pseudouridine used in Pfizer’s and Moderna’s COVID-19 vaccines were much more likely to induce frameshifted proteins than mRNAs with normal uridines. In their experiments, roughly 8% of the proteins produced from their experimental mRNAs were frameshifted.
The Cambridge team emphasized at a press briefing that its work doesn’t indicate COVID-19 vaccines are unsafe. Indeed, Karikó notes that frameshifts frequently occur naturally when infected cells make viral proteins. These frameshifted proteins can naturally broaden the body’s immune response, she says, so it’s possible that the spike-targeting COVID-19 vaccines may even get a boost from the misreading. When asked about the new paper, Pfizer did not directly comment on its findings but in a statement said its vaccines had a “positive benefit-risk profile.” A Moderna spokesperson declined to comment.
https://www.science.org/content/article/mrna-vaccines-may-make-unintended-proteins-there-s-no-evidence-harm#:~:text=The%20researchers%20found%20that%20mRNAs,their%20experimental%20mRNAs%20were%20frameshifted.
你仔细读一下论文图1，最低表达活性是接近0。 但是疫苗怎么做的细节不清楚，所以并不是降低了8%。 根据该实验结果，到0是完全可能的。
没事，有些治疗癌症的药一直有效，多年后发现有效的根本不是他们认为的那个蛋白。
这个也很简单，看看这几年死亡人数变化就知道了，到底少死多少人？比疫苗前有90%下降吗？ 显然是胡吹的注水疫苗
我觉得这个前半段靠谱，后半段存疑。 frameshift产生新肽段其实也没啥可怕的，就算你正常感染病毒，也会产生。但是说broaden immune response就有点牵强了。
你这属于胡说八道了。P家和M家的初始疫苗，90%的有效率是几万人的trial做出来的，数据是非常valid的。
你转的这种基础体外研究，离临床结果差十万八千里。
我不但被骂 还被封了n个账号 哈
我认识的一个人，打过2次MRNA疫苗没有啥不良反应，没打加强针。最后那次疫苗打完的两年多之后，感染了新冠，得新冠后引发了血栓，去医院住了大概4到5天院。
一个西方版，一个东方版而已。
恰好美国笃信阴谋论的也是老人居多。
这个是肯定的，现在病毒变异太快，而针对新流行的变异设计新版本的疫苗要花时间，等出来了，病毒已经又变异到不知哪儿去了。
正常感染病毒是不太可能会产生mRNA 疫苗的那种+1 frameshift 新肽段。 这里原文作者是有论述的。
这篇文章对今后的mRNA vaccine and therapy 都有很好的指导左右。以后设计mRNA 疫苗，都要test translation fidelity, optimize the RNA sequence to avoid slippery sites.
文章最后一段，作者成功的identify 了两个slippery site, 并且对其进行mutate以后，misreading frameshift 大大降低了。
It is not feasible that these data are a consequence of natural SARS-CoV-2 infection for the following, non-exhaustive, reasons. First, no frameshifting activity is known to occur during SARS-CoV-2 spike subgenomic mRNA translation (which would be a major discovery in its own right). Second, −1 frameshifting (and not +1 frameshifting) is restricted to a single programmed site in ORF1a and ORF1b (ref. 23). Third, +1 frameshifted peptides are predicted from the BNT162b2 mRNA sequence, and not the S gene sequence from wild virus (Extended Data Fig. 4). Instead, these data suggest that vaccination with 1-methylΨ mRNA can elicit cellular immunity to peptide antigens produced by +1 ribosomal frameshifting in both major histocompatibility complex (MHC)-diverse people and MHC-uniform mice.
不太明白你说的最底表达活性接近0 是什么意思。 图一是说如果mRNA 用了N1 pseduoU, 那么表达出来的蛋白，其中8% 是 1+frame shift. 对比图1B和图1C的第三根柱子，可以大概得出这个值。这只是一个体外的实验。
真正有参考意义的是图二d的病人血清， 21人当中有5个人产生了 +1 的frameshift. 所以是非常普遍的。
没有直接证据显示，这种frame shift 对人体产生不良反应。
10年前打这家的流感疫苗，差一点就要了小命，非常凶险。
...These frameshifted proteins can naturally broaden the body’s immune response...
Ins't this exactly the trigger for auto-immune disease?
你对临床数据好像有重大误解： 没检测到，不代表没产生过！ 仅仅表示检测时的值低于检测最低范围或者假阴性， 但是完全可能打完疫苗后实际很高啊 5/21=23.8% 完全证实不是8%，而是远远大于8%
如果cherry pick也算作假的话，nature上的paper 99%作假。
只是敢拿出来给这么多人用的，那是国家级别的造假，这种过去不常见，这真是太急功近利了。
大部分，造假都是止步于paper，药厂能用的，fda, cms肯批准的。也常见造假，但是过去都是小规模，小公司。你可以follow新闻，他们的retraction和各种政府起诉他们的官司，层出不穷。
政治形势所迫，经济利益驱动 妖蛾子总是会有的
你属于蚂蚁撼大树，没看清风向 现在风向变了
对地，我已经听说过好多人最近两年得auto-immune disease的了
现在说不是晚了吗， 不过早说了没人听，被骂了无数次。
还找小浣熊呢！人家估计从疫苗公司拿到丰厚奖金忙着数钱呢！ 等下次需要忽悠大家打疫苗的时候才会出来的。
记得孩子们的是P家的
以前我都以为网上这些疫苗副作用是反疫苗人士的夸大其词
上个月和某新同事聊天 她说自己打了pfizer 疫苗以后7个月几乎无法正常生活 我才意识到副作用有多么糟糕。 她说白天还好，一到晚上就发烧，发冷，浑身到处疼，然后一边的胳膊疼得跟残废了一样，听得我眼泪都下来了
难以置信。这是疫苗引起的什么疾病？
英国剑桥大学的研究
高中没学过生物....我们省理科班是三选二，我选的物理和化学....麻烦多科普些😂
新西兰疫苗死亡率的机密数据被新西兰卫生部的一名员工爆料！根据他的分析，特定疫苗批次的接种后死亡人数似乎不成比例，特别是在新西兰南岛，南岛的因弗卡吉尔市报告了30%的接种后死亡率，远高于该国的平均死亡率0.7%！！ Liz Gunn披露51人同一注射点相继死亡. Barry Young 曝光了10个批次的疫苗造成了超高死亡率，其中一个注射点的837次注射导致了253个死亡，近30%死亡率。新西兰政府将其逮捕，并且正在起诉他7年监禁
https://twitter.com/forest_of_shire/status/1731545978820579527
https://rumble.com/v3ynskd-operation-m.o.a.r-mother-of-all-revelations.html