Regarding to your #2. I think you tried to explain the contradiction away by adding your own words on top of God's word. It is a Sin to do that.
God never said that He means Justification in James is before men. Actually why do you care about Justification before men. Your eternal life is given by God, NOT by men.
You hear this kind of explanation in Chinese churches so often. They don't know the answer, but pretend to know. So they invent. They think they know Bible better than Martin Luther. (http://www.biblestudy.org/question/why-did-martin-luther-want-book-of-james-out-of-bible.html)
【 在 Primeval (waaaowao) 的大作中提到: 】 : Romans : Justification : : 1. OK. "Lordship Salvation" is NOT biblical, meaning, If a person think : salvation is not free and he wants to save himself with his own work, he : will never succeed and end up losing the free salvation. And "easy- : believism" is NOT biblical. meaning, If a person thought he is saved : through an acknowledgement of a certain set of facts without repenting, : accepting Jesus as his savior and Lord, he is actually not saved. : Are we on the same page now? :) : ...................
Salvation is an on-going process that has three stages: justification, sanctification, and glorification. It begins at the moment of justification when we are saved from our sins and made righteous before God, continues throughout a believer’s life saving him from the power of sin ( sanctification), and consummates when believers are endowed with moral perfection and immortal resurrected bodies (glorification).
【 在 ngi098 (Ngi) 的大作中提到: 】 : I think your mix Salvation with Sanctification. : The Salvation is FREE!! : The Salvation given by God to us is by Grace, through Faith. : (Romans 11:6 : And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more : grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no : more work.) : It has NOTHING to do with our works. : (Ephesians 2:8 : For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is : ...................
Oh I really don’t have any concerns. I asked a rhetorical question just to make a point not to elicit an answer.
Speaking of the guy in the video you recommended, I couldn’t stand him for more than two minutes. I really have no idea how he got into the business of preaching coz his understanding of the scriptures is quite comparable to that of ‘老七”.
Romans was written to both Jewish and Gentile Christians while James was written to Jewish Christians. God doesn’t apply double standards depending on what kind of Christians we are. Paul emphasized faith alone because some Jewish Christians were trying to impose works of Law on justification, especially circumcision, not because he opposed works of faith. If you read throughout Romans, it is very hard for you not to get the impression of how much Paul cared about works of faith.
Chinese Christians are divided on some advanced theological issues but not on basic issues like this. I think an average Chinese church can do a pretty decent job explaining this so-called contradiction. It is possible that your church is weak and cant really explain anything, or you simply don’t want to accept their explanation.
【 在 ngi098 (Ngi) 的大作中提到: 】 : Check out this video. https://youtu.be/hlHA9_ZvIIU : It answered your concerns!! : as
The fad of “Free Grace” is picking up around the world in recent years. They are touting such crazy ideas like ‘you don’t need to repent, just believe’ and ‘you can be wicked your whole life but still saved because you believed’.
This makes me think of the devil’s faith. The devil never repents, never shows any works of faith, and is wicked throughout his whole existence. Can you say that he is not saved? Maybe not according to the Free Grace camp, because he has faith in God too, somewhere deep inside, too deep and hidden so well that nobody knows, at least not through the works he does.
You might want to turn back before you are taken too far down the road of Free Grace.
【 在 ngi098 (Ngi) 的大作中提到: 】 : I think it's bad teaching because it is NOT biblical. : Lordship Salvation is so commonly taught, especially in Chinese Churches!!: Please study Dispensationism from Dr. Kim. He has a great video on it: : https://youtu.be/GI4CteEFxOk : My church teaches lordship salvation too. Since there are a lot of : contradictions between Paul's teaching and other apostles' teaching, they : usually can't really answer any questions on those contradiction. : I feel so disappointed that there are so little Chinese who understand God's : Grace!!! : I think it might be our Chinese traditions. Grace means: : ...................
If you don't have an open mind, then we should stop this conversation.
I see lots of so called long term Christians just like you in my Chinese churches. They think they are very spiritual and never been able to understand what God's grace is.
【 在 EpochLife (Wind) 的大作中提到: 】 : Oh I really don’t have any concerns. I asked a rhetorical question just to : make a point not to elicit an answer. : Speaking of the guy in the video you recommended, I couldn’t stand him for : more than two minutes. I really have no idea how he got into the business of : preaching coz his understanding of the scriptures is quite comparable to : that of ‘老七”. : Romans was written to both Jewish and Gentile Christians while James was : written to Jewish Christians. God doesn’t apply double standards depending : on what kind of Christians we are. Paul emphasized faith alone because some : Jewish Christians were trying to impose works of Law on justification, : ...................
老兄还是执迷不悟。
基督教的 喜乐 和 佛教的 悟 基本是一个意思。
你们信基督教后没有得到喜乐，说明和洋人的文化还是格格不入。
佛教的禅宗已经中国化了，非常适合中国人。里面的故事中国人喜闻乐见。
圣经不是不好，但是那主要是写给另一个文化传统的人看的。里面的人甚至吃，喝。姓名等等中国人听上去都怪怪的，能共鸣吗？
看世界喜乐排名：
佛教国尼泊尔排101，基督教文化的欧美前20.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Happiness_Report
佛教没有办法给人带来喜乐，基督教才可以。
一个真的信仰是超越文化的。
谁说基督教不能给中国人喜乐？你又不是基督徒，你怎么知道？
【 在 leuning (none) 的大作中提到: 】
: 老兄还是执迷不悟。
: 基督教的 喜乐 和 佛教的 悟 基本是一个意思。
: 你们，说明和洋人的文化
还是格格不入。
: 佛教的禅宗已经中国化了，非常适合中国人。里面的故事中国人喜闻乐见。
: 圣经不是不好，但是那主要是写给另一个文化传统的人看的。里面的人甚至吃，喝。姓
: 名等等中国人听上去都怪怪的，能共鸣吗？
【 在 leuning (none) 的大作中提到: 】
基督教的 喜乐 和 佛教的 悟 基本是一个意思。
==================================
這種說話, 要精通基督教和佛教的才有資格講。
你是否精通佛教， 我暫時仍未覺得。
你不通基督教， 從#96; #99便頗能肯定了。
【 在 leuning (none) 的大作中提到: 】
佛教的禅宗已经中国化了，非常适合中国人。
里面的故事中国人喜闻乐见。
＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝
今日中國的佛教， 混雜了茅山術士的道家，
走了樣。
佛陀翻生也要搖頭。
【 在 leuning (none) 的大作中提到: 】
里面的人甚至吃，喝。姓
名等等中国人听上去都怪怪的，能共鸣吗？
＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝＝
唵嘛呢叭咪吽；
。。。
觀自在菩薩。行深波若波羅蜜多時；
揭諦揭諦。波羅揭諦。波羅僧揭諦。菩提薩婆訶。。。；
『怛姪他。頞闌帝。頞藍謎。室利鞞。室里室里。磨羯失質。三婆跋睹。莎訶。』
勃塔，母馱，沒馱；
這些怪不怪？
有甚麼共鳴？
You guys are unhappy. So christianity is not working for you guys so far.
For佛教, if you can access a good teacher, it will be super fun. And there are some good ones from Taiwan live here.
Same thing for基督教. A great teacher can make the difference. No access
to a great teacher is the issue for you guys to learn 基督教.
No time for your #1.
Regarding to your #2. I think you tried to explain the contradiction away by adding your own words on top of God's word. It is a Sin to do that.
God never said that He means Justification in James is before men.
Actually why do you care about Justification before men. Your eternal life
is given by God, NOT by men.
You hear this kind of explanation in Chinese churches so often.
They don't know the answer, but pretend to know. So they invent. They think they know Bible better than Martin Luther.
(http://www.biblestudy.org/question/why-did-martin-luther-want-book-of-james-out-of-bible.html)
【 在 Primeval (waaaowao) 的大作中提到: 】
: Romans
: Justification
:
: 1. OK. "Lordship Salvation" is NOT biblical, meaning, If a person think
: salvation is not free and he wants to save himself with his own work, he
: will never succeed and end up losing the free salvation. And "easy-
: believism" is NOT biblical. meaning, If a person thought he is saved
: through an acknowledgement of a certain set of facts without repenting,
: accepting Jesus as his savior and Lord, he is actually not saved.
: Are we on the same page now? :)
: ...................
I don’t think you understand what salvation is.
Salvation is an on-going process that has three stages: justification,
sanctification, and glorification. It begins at the moment of justification when we are saved from our sins and made righteous before God, continues
throughout a believer’s life saving him from the power of sin (
sanctification), and consummates when believers are endowed with moral
perfection and immortal resurrected bodies (glorification).
【 在 ngi098 (Ngi) 的大作中提到: 】
: I think your mix Salvation with Sanctification.
: The Salvation is FREE!!
: The Salvation given by God to us is by Grace, through Faith.
: (Romans 11:6
: And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more
: grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no
: more work.)
: It has NOTHING to do with our works.
: (Ephesians 2:8
: For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is
: ...................
Oh I really don’t have any concerns. I asked a rhetorical question just to make a point not to elicit an answer.
Speaking of the guy in the video you recommended, I couldn’t stand him for more than two minutes. I really have no idea how he got into the business of preaching coz his understanding of the scriptures is quite comparable to
that of ‘老七”.
Romans was written to both Jewish and Gentile Christians while James was
written to Jewish Christians. God doesn’t apply double standards depending on what kind of Christians we are. Paul emphasized faith alone because some Jewish Christians were trying to impose works of Law on justification,
especially circumcision, not because he opposed works of faith. If you read throughout Romans, it is very hard for you not to get the impression of how much Paul cared about works of faith.
Chinese Christians are divided on some advanced theological issues but not
on basic issues like this. I think an average Chinese church can do a pretty decent job explaining this so-called contradiction. It is possible that
your church is weak and cant really explain anything, or you simply don’t
want to accept their explanation.
【 在 ngi098 (Ngi) 的大作中提到: 】
: Check out this video. https://youtu.be/hlHA9_ZvIIU
: It answered your concerns!!
: as
The fad of “Free Grace” is picking up around the world in recent years.
They are touting such crazy ideas like ‘you don’t need to repent, just
believe’ and ‘you can be wicked your whole life but still saved because
you believed’.
This makes me think of the devil’s faith. The devil never repents, never
shows any works of faith, and is wicked throughout his whole existence. Can you say that he is not saved? Maybe not according to the Free Grace camp,
because he has faith in God too, somewhere deep inside, too deep and hidden so well that nobody knows, at least not through the works he does.
You might want to turn back before you are taken too far down the road of
Free Grace.
【 在 ngi098 (Ngi) 的大作中提到: 】
: I think it's bad teaching because it is NOT biblical.
: Lordship Salvation is so commonly taught, especially in Chinese Churches!!: Please study Dispensationism from Dr. Kim. He has a great video on it:
: https://youtu.be/GI4CteEFxOk
: My church teaches lordship salvation too. Since there are a lot of
: contradictions between Paul's teaching and other apostles' teaching, they : usually can't really answer any questions on those contradiction.
: I feel so disappointed that there are so little Chinese who understand God's
: Grace!!!
: I think it might be our Chinese traditions. Grace means:
: ...................
If you don't have an open mind, then we should stop this conversation.
I see lots of so called long term Christians just like you in my Chinese
churches. They think they are very spiritual and never been able to
understand what God's grace is.
【 在 EpochLife (Wind) 的大作中提到: 】
: Oh I really don’t have any concerns. I asked a rhetorical question just
to
: make a point not to elicit an answer.
: Speaking of the guy in the video you recommended, I couldn’t stand him
for
: more than two minutes. I really have no idea how he got into the business of
: preaching coz his understanding of the scriptures is quite comparable to : that of ‘老七”.
: Romans was written to both Jewish and Gentile Christians while James was
: written to Jewish Christians. God doesn’t apply double standards
depending
: on what kind of Christians we are. Paul emphasized faith alone because
some
: Jewish Christians were trying to impose works of Law on justification,
: ...................
【 在 mafbxh (whitehorse) 的大作中提到: 】
: 看世界喜乐排名：
: 佛教国尼泊尔排101，基督教文化的欧美前20.
:
要点脸皮行不行？欧美喜乐排名高和基督教有什么关系？那是因为欧美比较富裕！如果基督教能让一个国家喜乐排名提高，海地呢？乌干达呢？卢旺达呢？马拉维呢？很多很多基督教人口远超欧美的极端贫穷落后的国家的喜乐程度如何？
就你这种智商，也难怪会被忽悠成基督徒！
【 在 wusuoju (嘁哩喀喳) 的大作中提到: 】
: :
: 要点脸皮行不行？欧美喜乐排名高和基督教有什么关系？那是因为欧美比较富裕！
====================================
這又是甚麼的智商，
把喜樂與富裕掛釣
早陣子的富商kate Spade 上吊自殺了。
不見得有錢如會喜樂。
是否暗示了你現在是有點缺錢，
所以不喜樂？
抹油不是大多数基督教徒的死穴。
但是像福音派这样的圣经上每个字都照搬的，确实是死穴。
【 在 leuning (none) 的大作中提到: 】
: 抹油不是大多数基督教徒的死穴。
: 但是像福音派这样的圣经上每个字都照搬的，确实是死穴。
哈哈哈！生病了要抹油加祷告，这是你家“全知全能”“看千年如一日”的主子通过“新约”启示出来的教导，基督徒们有权不遵守吗？
基督徒们嘴上把“圣经”说得很神圣，行动上把“圣经”“新约”当成那种难闻的气体放掉了。令人鄙视！
我又不是基督徒。
不过在基督教国家，你要从别人的角度看问题。
人家从小信教，发现如果照搬圣经会不适应社会现状，于是变通。这是好事。
不要去嘲笑人家？
倒是这里有基督教的少数派宣传封建迷信，应该反一反。
请基们继续！
好帖顶起来
口吃又自闭的“嘁哩喀喳”！
这个“喳喳”约有二十年，不断地，在豆瓣、知乎、文学城等等地方，发表极端反基督教的言论。但是，他在这些地方，根本是重复、重复同样的一些问题，所以我想他是口吃的。他的最爱，却是和色情有关的！你可以知道他是一个什么样的人！（有说他实践男女双修）。
我曾在豆瓣他的小组曾经回答他，但他马上把我封杀。想你明白原因，但是他仍然继续不断地到处重复他那几个傻问题。
无论如何，我都回答了。请见：
「回应豆瓣无神反基人士言论」（https://www.douban.com/group/657478/）
和我的“知乎”主页（https://www.zhihu.com/people/ji-zi-er-64/posts）。
如果以后发现他还有值得回答的题目，我会继续回答。
现在让我为他写一首诗！
献给嘁哩喀喳
=========
吃儿女肉人惊讶
露女人下体尴尬
重复重复又重复
口吃吃嘁哩喀喳
=========
喳喳有一句口头禅：「明明白纸黑字的写著……」。 为什么我这样讲呢？举个例，当我解释“吃儿女肉”是一个表达方式，是形容战争的残酷。他就说：「明明白纸黑字的写著……」。如果你留意他，你应该看见他多次如此胡涂！
为什么喳喳无法明白我的解释呢？我想他无法明白抽象的对话。他只能明白直接的表达方式。例如，我若说：「某人的名字如雷灌耳。」他必然会说：「我没有听到雷声，哪有？」
有什么原因叫一个人不能明白抽象对话——自闭症！ 所以喳喳除了口吃，还自闭！
现在让我再为他写一首诗！
献给嘁哩喀喳 #2
=========
听不懂抽象说话
好心解释被践踏
只一句白纸黑字
口吃自闭是喳喳
=========
口吃又自闭的“嘁哩喀喳”！
这个“喳喳”约有二十年，不断地，在豆瓣、知乎、文学城等等地方，发表极端反基督教的言论。但是，他在这些地方，根本是重复、重复同样的一些问题，所以我想他是口吃的。他的最爱，却是和色情有关的！你可以知道他是一个什么样的人！（有说他实践男女双修）。
我曾在豆瓣他的小组曾经回答他，但他马上把我封杀。想你明白原因，但是他仍然继续不断地到处重复他那几个傻问题。
无论如何，我都回答了。请见：
「回应豆瓣无神反基人士言论」（https://www.douban.com/group/657478/）
和我的“知乎”主页（https://www.zhihu.com/people/ji-zi-er-64/posts）。
如果以后发现他还有值得回答的题目，我会继续回答。
现在让我为他写一首诗！
献给嘁哩喀喳
=========
吃儿女肉人惊讶
露女人下体尴尬
重复重复又重复
口吃吃嘁哩喀喳
=========
喳喳有一句口头禅：「明明白纸黑字的写著……」。 为什么我这样讲呢？举个例，当我解释“吃儿女肉”是一个表达方式，是形容战争的残酷。他就说：「明明白纸黑字的写著……」。如果你留意他，你应该看见他多次如此胡涂！
为什么喳喳无法明白我的解释呢？我想他无法明白抽象的对话。他只能明白直接的表达方式。例如，我若说：「某人的名字如雷灌耳。」他必然会说：「我没有听到雷声，哪有？」
有什么原因叫一个人不能明白抽象对话——自闭症！ 所以喳喳除了口吃，还自闭！
现在让我再为他写一首诗！
献给嘁哩喀喳 #2
=========
听不懂抽象说话
好心解释被践踏
只一句白纸黑字
口吃自闭是喳喳
=========