其实生物医药领域中国正在反超

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laohua001
楼主 (北美华人网)
A little-known Chinese company made a drug that beat the world’s biggest-selling medicine
CNN —  China’s DeepSeek shocked the world by delivering unexpected innovation at an unbelievable price. But this disruptive trend isn’t confined to Big Tech: it has been quietly happening in the pharmaceutical sector. In September, Akeso, a little-known Chinese biotech company founded nearly a decade ago shook up the biotech sector with its new lung cancer drug.
Ivonescimab, the new drug, was found in a trial conducted in China to have bested Keytruda, the blockbuster medication developed by Merck that has raked in more than $130 billion in sales for the American behemoth that has dominated cancer treatment.
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laohua001
科学技术这东西本身就是高投入高知识,劳动密集型产业。都是中国强项。
美国鼓吹天才的leadership,注定失败
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dodgers
现在大陆在生物制药方面投入比美国高,pipeline比美国大厂的多不少。美国药厂从大陆license 很多。
目前看,中国生物制药需要的人才是,熟悉FDA流程的,可以帮助大陆药在美国过FDA.
确实不少做生物的海龟。
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claireliu
认识人海归了国内药厂,在这边管60个phd在国内管>200个,虽然各种吐槽,但我觉得这个配置国内怎么也能干出点东西来吧。
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singlemummy
laohua001 发表于 2025-02-26 08:56
科学技术这东西本身就是高投入高知识,劳动密集型产业。都是中国强项。
美国鼓吹天才的leadership,注定失败

俺个人认为, leadership 是做出来的,而不是吹出来的, leadership 是结果,而不是可操作参数
二战乃至二战后,美国的研发,生产 ,组织能力, 比现在强的多,结果是成了世界leader
现在连组织阿波罗计划的能力都没有了, 当年航母战舰跟下饺子一样,现在任何一个ppt 以外的产品都要等几年。。。。。
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leavingsmile
这个,如果是业内人士,了解国内制药的话,就不会这么说了。
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singlemummy
现在大陆在生物制药方面投入比美国高,pipeline比美国大厂的多不少。美国药厂从大陆license 很多。
目前看,中国生物制药需要的人才是,熟悉FDA流程的,可以帮助大陆药在美国过FDA.
确实不少做生物的海龟。
dodgers 发表于 2025-02-26 09:02

不了解制药的就别想当然了
国内小分子制药才刚热乎, 生物制药还差得远, 不论研, 发, 还是生产,申报,乃至clinical trial,质量体系,合规操作等 都还在起步阶段, 更别提 啥熟悉FDA流程的。。。。 这种人在美国都缺 至于大陆药过美国FDA, 这个事情有多个因素决定,不是说来个养鸡专业户的的人就能让小狗下蛋的
X
XDKS2023
自己高兴就好!
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claireliu
singlemummy 发表于 2025-02-26 09:08
不了解制药的就别想当然了
国内小分子制药才刚热乎, 生物制药还差得远, 不论研, 发, 还是生产,申报,乃至clinical trial,质量体系,合规操作等 都还在起步阶段, 更别提 啥熟悉FDA流程的。。。。 这种人在美国都缺 至于大陆药过美国FDA, 这个事情有多个因素决定,不是说来个养鸡专业户的的人就能让小狗下蛋的

FDA不是正好在裁员吗。虽然咱们不都是业内人士,但楼主贴了新闻source,也不可能完全是空穴来风。
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polyoma2002
制药不仅是高投入,还需要后面有大市场。等到中国医保能支撑大量中国开发的新药的时候,中国医药才可能超过美国。最近几年医保没钱,国内药企都在搞出海,所以才有这么多license out。要是能自己开发,谁会愿意卖出去呢。
p
pj
什么反超不反超的,赶紧把老百姓用的集采药质量先搞上去
J
Jennyw2017
几年前看过有本土烙印到中国药厂工作的。好像就是搞许可证方面的。
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singlemummy
FDA不是正好在裁员吗。虽然咱们不都是业内人士,但楼主贴了新闻source,也不可能完全是空穴来风。
claireliu 发表于 2025-02-26 09:18

FDA 是在裁员,但这不意味着通过BLA审批会容易, 实际上99%的可能是审批会更拖延 楼上说的这个bispecific antibody 比 keytruda efficacy 高那是非常正常的事情, 这俩是同一个治疗类别,但不同机理结构的药物。 在bispecific这个类别中, 这个是个成功研发的例子, 这个类别中FDA 批了好几个了,后面还会有更多, 在抗体药物的发展中,这个将是一大类。 中国药企在非前沿领域是有个别的成功案例的,但是并不能抗衡美国药企研发的整体实力。 另外上面这个药物的只是被中国批准了,还未得到FDA批准, 无法在国外上市,而国内的环境,集采大政之下, 这个药能赚多少钱还是未知数.而想通过FDA审批, 除非极其特例的情况, 否则multi-regional clinical trial 基本绕不过去,那么additional clinical trial 的cost 是否能够承担,或者有partner加入。。。。。 毕竟美国市场才是真正的利润蛋糕
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wanamon
迟早的事,不是嘛
B
Beingyourself
天天超,真实中国是一个时代已经结束了 今年过完年,出去打工,年龄超过40岁都已经回家,无工可打了
和大跃进 是不是同一个配方,天天放卫星,亩产万斤,饿死一堆人,人吃人

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Namama


所以美国又要以国安为理由来制裁封锁了

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Namama
中国医药发展最大的问题是:
中国国内市场被管制,政府严重向患者利益倾斜,导致医药研发很难赚大钱,市场规模差美国太远 市场不在自己手上,就容易被美国搞
但是美国那么畸形的医疗市场,其他国家也真心学不来,会暴动的


w
wswsn
生物医学的人才储备,美国还是远超其它国家的
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snowerrrr
中国那弯道超车的聪明劲儿真能用到潜心研究上吗?连集采药检都懒得做,直接结果copy paste。反正HPV疫苗是全盘超过来的,哪有什么自主研发。所以上来就几个亿的临床试验,因为知道不会有错。
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snowerrrr
wswsn 发表于 2025-02-26 23:11
生物医学的人才储备,美国还是远超其它国家的

这个老本不知道还能吃几年。。。
y
youyouzou
FDA 是在裁员,但这不意味着通过BLA审批会容易, 实际上99%的可能是审批会更拖延 楼上说的这个bispecific antibody 比 keytruda efficacy 高那是非常正常的事情, 这俩是同一个治疗类别,但不同机理结构的药物。 在bispecific这个类别中, 这个是个成功研发的例子, 这个类别中FDA 批了好几个了,后面还会有更多, 在抗体药物的发展中,这个将是一大类。 中国药企在非前沿领域是有个别的成功案例的,但是并不能抗衡美国药企研发的整体实力。 另外上面这个药物的只是被中国批准了,还未得到FDA批准, 无法在国外上市,而国内的环境,集采大政之下, 这个药能赚多少钱还是未知数.而想通过FDA审批, 除非极其特例的情况, 否则multi-regional clinical trial 基本绕不过去,那么additional clinical trial 的cost 是否能够承担,或者有partner加入。。。。。 毕竟美国市场才是真正的利润蛋糕
singlemummy 发表于 2025-02-26 10:22

啥是 bispecific antibody ? 比 K药好在哪?
y
youyouzou
laohua001 发表于 2025-02-26 08:54
A little-known Chinese company made a drug that beat the world’s biggest-selling medicine
CNN —  China’s DeepSeek shocked the world by delivering unexpected innovation at an unbelievable price. But this disruptive trend isn’t confined to Big Tech: it has been quietly happening in the pharmaceutical sector. In September, Akeso, a little-known Chinese biotech company founded nearly a decade ago shook up the biotech sector with its new lung cancer drug.
Ivonescimab, the new drug, was found in a trial conducted in China to have bested Keytruda, the blockbuster medication developed by Merck that has raked in more than $130 billion in sales for the American behemoth that has dominated cancer treatment.

这个药也是 免疫药吗?
对K药严重副反应(同时超级有效,免疫风暴那种)的lung cancer patient 可以用这个药吗?
y
yup
我認識的前幾年海歸的藥廠D以上都又歸海了
m
mailan
不知道华人大妈大爷成天发这种帖子是不是太无知了
美帝国早就在垂死的道路上狂奔了 各方面全面落后 难道华大妈华大爷才知道??

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isUNsHine
中国是个巨大的船,船里装了各种各样的东西,太多太多,所以起步很难,但成功起步了后,要停下来也不容易。
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cllliff
emm
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keytosun
一点也不奇怪吧。大量的生物医药人才回国了。现在留下来的真的很少了。
单身男
回复 1楼 laohua001 的帖子
你现在才知道么? https://www.wsj.com/health/pharma/the-drug-industry-is-having-its-own-deepseek-moment-68589d70
The biotech industry’s DeepSeek moment came last fall. That is when Summit Therapeutics SMMT -2.06%decrease; red down pointing triangle , backed by billionaire Bob Duggan, announced that its drug had outperformed Merck’s blockbuster therapy Keytruda in a head-to-head lung-cancer trial. Keytruda, a $30 billion-a-year immunotherapy juggernaut, is the bestselling drug in the pharma industry and has long dominated the market. So the prospect of a superior competitor was seismic. Even more remarkable: Summit had licensed the drug just two years earlier from a little known Chinese biotech called Akeso 9926 -1.33%decrease; red down pointing triangle . The news added billions of dollars to Summit’s market capitalization, catapulting it into biotech’s upper ranks despite having no approved drugs. While Summit’s drug still hasn’t received U.S. regulatory approval, the results were a watershed moment for the industry, underscoring the competitive threat emanating from China. China’s rise in biotech has been years in the making, but it is now impossible to ignore. In 2020, less than 5% of large pharmaceutical transactions worth $50 million or more upfront involved China. By 2024, that number had surged to nearly 30%, according to DealForma. A decade from now, many drugs hitting the U.S. market will have originated in Chinese labs. Share of global drug licensing deals from​China Source: DealForma Database Note: Percentage of $50 million+ upfront Big Pharma​licensing deals originating from China. 2025 is​through 1/21 2020 '25 0 5 10 15 20 25 30 35 %
China’s biotech boom mirrors its rise in tech. In both cases, China has moved up the value chain, from manufacturing goods to becoming a more sophisticated hub for innovation, competing in industries once dominated by the U.S. There are several reasons for the industry’s growth. For one, many top scientists trained in the U.S. have returned to China over the past decade, fueling the emergence of biotech hubs around Shanghai. And just as DeepSeek built a formidable chatbot—allegedly on a lean budget with limited access to semiconductors—Chinese biotech companies are also scrappier, capitalizing on a highly skilled, lower-cost workforce that can move faster. Additionally, companies can conduct clinical trials at a fraction of what they would cost in the U.S., while recent changes in the Chinese regulatory system have streamlined and accelerated the approval process to get a study started.  For now, much of China’s biotech innovation is incremental rather than groundbreaking. Many companies focus on improving existing drugs—tweaking the chemistry, enhancing efficacy or differentiating them in key ways. But Chinese innovation is steadily improving and is already starting to disrupt the U.S. drug-development ecosystem. For decades, the U.S. biotech industry has thrived in hubs such as Boston-Cambridge and the San Francisco Bay Area, fueled by talent streaming from top academic centers like Massachusetts Institute of Technology and Stanford University. Those biotech companies have an insatiable client in Big Pharma, which is willing to pay top dollar for new drugs to replace those going off-patent. While that isn’t going away, chief executives of large pharmaceutical companies are broadening their horizons. Why spend $10 billion acquiring a U.S. biotech with a mid-stage drug when a similar molecule can be licensed from China for a fraction of the price? 

WHAT’S NEWS Chinese Biotech Is Having A DeepSeek Moment

12:031x SUBSCRIBE
Explore Audio Center The red-hot obesity-drug market offers one example. Eli Lilly LLY -3.00%decrease; red down pointing triangle  and Novo Nordisk NOVO.B -0.86%decrease; red down pointing triangle  are the dominant players with GLP-1 drugs such as Wegovy and Zepbound. At this stage in the obesity drug market, it makes sense for some large pharma companies to skip over trying to develop an injection and try instead to make a more convenient pill. Merck and AstraZeneca AZN 0.84%increase; green up pointing triangle  are two pharma companies looking for a way in, and both turned to China for earlier stage orals under development. In late 2024, after scouring the market for obesity assets—presumably eyeing U.S. companies like Viking Therapeutics VKTX 3.32%increase; green up pointing triangle , which trades at a market value of around $3.7 billion—Merck chose to license an oral GLP-1 drug from China’s Hansoh Pharma 3692 2.63%increase; green up pointing triangle . The deal: $112 million upfront, with potential milestone payments of up to $1.9 billion. A year earlier, AstraZeneca made a similar move, paying $185 million upfront with future milestones totaling nearly $1.83 billion in a deal with China’s Eccogene. These “bargain” deals are great for Big Pharma. But for U.S. biotech companies—and their venture-capital backers—they are creating real challenges. Investors increasingly struggle to value early-stage biotechs because it is difficult to predict what competition might emerge from China. That is at least part of the reason why the S&P Biotech ETF has been basically flat over the past two years, while the S&P 500 has surged 48%. “It’s unquestionable that this has been a big negative for the U.S. biotech ecosystem,” said Tim Opler, a managing director of investment banking at Stifel. “The real question now is how to adapt. How do you maintain leadership in innovation while improving cost efficiency and speed?”
SHARE YOUR THOUGHTS How do you think China’s biotech industry will change U.S. healthcare? Join the conversation below. From a patient’s perspective, the growing global competition is a win. People with cancer probably don’t care which country a drug was developed in. What matters is that it works. But for policymakers focused on maintaining America’s competitive edge, China’s biotech surge is a wake-up call. The innovation race isn’t limited to AI or crypto—it extends deep into life sciences. Summit’s partnership with Akeso didn’t go unnoticed by Merck. Just months after Summit’s clinical-trial results, Merck said it had licensed another promising cancer drug that essentially followed the Summit-Akeso approach of a dual-target antibody that hits both PD-1, an immune checkpoint that cancers exploit to hide from the immune system, and VEGF, a protein that helps tumors grow new blood vessels. And where did Merck find this drug? At a private biotech company, LaNova Medicines, based in Shanghai. “If you’re looking for innovation,” Duggan, Summit’s billionaire leader said in a recent interview, “that’s the logical place to go.”
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EvenOdd
Q
美国《华尔街日报》将康方生物的成果称为“生物技术行业的DeepSeek时刻”。该报承认,在AI和生物技术两个行业中,中国都在价值链上攀升,从制造商品走到了更为复杂的创新枢纽,与曾经主导行业的美国竞争。 在最近十多年里,中国医药企业不断创新,研发出可以与西方竞争的药品。许多中企还与西方合作伙伴签署了数十亿美元的授权协议,将产品推广到世界各地。例如,中国石药集团在去年与英国阿斯利康公司签署了价值19.2亿美元的心血管药物授权协议。
联博集团制药分析师丽贝卡·梁(Rebecca Liang)表示:“人们知道中国的生物技术行业发展迅速,但很少有人认为这会对美国顶级医药公司构成威胁。现在,这种威胁正逐渐成为现实,因为你确实开始看到新一代药物。” 汇丰前海证券2月早些时候发布的一份报告显示,中国正成为医药行业的创新中心,授权交易数量已从2017年的46笔跃升到去年的超过200笔。汇丰前海证券估计,2017年的交易总金额约为40亿美元,但去年的交易额已上升到570亿美元。
根据美国投行Stifel的数据,2024年大型制药公司的授权交易中有1/3来自中国,两年前这个数字为12%。市场分析公司Mergermarket的数据则显示,在2024年,涉及中国企业的价值5000万美元以上的大型药品交易较前一年增长了近30%。
UQ
木牛流马
snowerrrr 发表于 2025-02-26 23:24
这个老本不知道还能吃几年。。。

自废武功从废了FDA开始。。。