IBA president Umar Kremlev said Khelif was "proven" to have XY chromosomes 但具体用什么手段测的IBA不公布 而时至今日两位有争议的运动员没一个站出来澄清自己不是XY的，所以这事基本没跑了 https://www.sportingnews.com/us/olympics/news/imane-khelif-gender-eligibility-test-ioc-iba-championship/f36302ed5889c11046e5c704
angelamela 发表于 2024-08-03 08:12 IBA president Umar Kremlev said Khelif was "proven" to have XY chromosomes 但具体用什么手段测的IBA不公布 而时至今日两位有争议的运动员没一个站出来澄清自己不是XY的，所以这事基本没跑了 https://www.sportingnews.com/us/olympics/news/imane-khelif-gender-eligibility-test-ioc-iba-championship/f36302ed5889c11046e5c704
"XY,还有睾酮过高都是外界猜测的" 根据下面这篇报道，非外界猜测： “Despite reaching the final of the World Championships in March 2023, Khelif was disqualified just before the bout for "medical reasons." In the weeks that followed, it emerged that Khelif was removed from the competition after drug tests confirmed high levels of testosterone. Following this incident, IBA president Umar Kremlev stated that these results proved that Khelif and other female athletes with elevated levels of testosterone carried male chromosomes.” Who is Imane Khelif? Bio and controversial history of Algerian Olympic boxer at Paris 2024 | Sporting News https://www.sportingnews.com/us/boxing/news/imane-khelif-bio-algerian-olympic-boxer-paris-2024/44959db4dc011af9076a4aeb#:~:text=In%20the%20weeks%20that%20followed%2C%20it%20emerged%20that,with%20elevated%20levels%20of%20testosterone%20carried%20male%20chromosomes.
回复 186楼 cinderedna 的帖子 "XY,还有睾酮过高都是外界猜测的" 根据下面这篇报道，非外界猜测： “Despite reaching the final of the World Championships in March 2023, Khelif was disqualified just before the bout for "medical reasons." In the weeks that followed, it emerged that Khelif was removed from the competition after drug tests confirmed high levels of testosterone. Following this incident, IBA president Umar Kremlev stated that these results proved that Khelif and other female athletes with elevated levels of testosterone carried male chromosomes.” Who is Imane Khelif? Bio and controversial history of Algerian Olympic boxer at Paris 2024 | Sporting News https://www.sportingnews.com/us/boxing/news/imane-khelif-bio-algerian-olympic-boxer-paris-2024/44959db4dc011af9076a4aeb#:~:text=In%20the%20weeks%20that%20followed%2C%20it%20emerged%20that,with%20elevated%20levels%20of%20testosterone%20carried%20male%20chromosomes.
After defeating all the women. 2 biological men will compete for Olympic Gold in women's boxing. pic.twitter.com/5DK5C2zGg8 — TheQuartering (@TheQuartering) August 3, 2024
International Olympic Committee Joint Paris 2024 Boxing Unit/IOC Statement 3 min read Published on 01 August 2024 IOC Statements IOC News Paris 2024 olympic-flag-featured Every person has the right to practise sport without discrimination. All athletes participating in the boxing tournament of the Olympic Games Paris 2024 comply with the competition’s eligibility and entry regulations, as well as all applicable medical regulations set by the Paris 2024 Boxing Unit (PBU) (please find all applicable rules here). As with previous Olympic boxing competitions, the gender and age of the athletes are based on their passport. These rules also applied during the qualification period, including the boxing tournaments of the 2023 European Games, Asian Games, Pan American Games and Pacific Games, the ad hoc 2023 African qualifying tournament in Dakar (SEN) and two world qualifying tournaments held in Busto Arsizio (ITA) and Bangkok (THA) in 2024, which involved a total of 1,471 different boxers from 172 National Olympic Committees (NOCs), the Boxing Refugee Team and Individual Neutral Athletes, and featured over 2,000 qualification bouts. The PBU used the Tokyo 2020 boxing rules as a baseline to develop its regulations for Paris 2024. This was to minimise the impact on athletes’ preparations and guarantee consistency between Olympic Games. These Tokyo 2020 rules were based on the post-Rio 2016 rules, which were in place before the suspension of the boxing International Federation by the IOC in 2019 and the subsequent withdrawal of its recognition in 2023. We have seen in reports misleading information about two female athletes competing at the Olympic Games Paris 2024. The two athletes have been competing in international boxing competitions for many years in the women’s category, including the Olympic Games Tokyo 2020, International Boxing Association (IBA) World Championships and IBA-sanctioned tournaments. These two athletes were the victims of a sudden and arbitrary decision by the IBA. Towards the end of the IBA World Championships in 2023, they were suddenly disqualified without any due process. According to the IBA minutes available on their website, this decision was initially taken solely by the IBA Secretary General and CEO. The IBA Board only ratified it afterwards and only subsequently requested that a procedure to follow in similar cases in the future be established and reflected in the IBA Regulations. The minutes also say that the IBA should “establish a clear procedure on gender testing”. The current aggression against these two athletes is based entirely on this arbitrary decision, which was taken without any proper procedure – especially considering that these athletes had been competing in top-level competition for many years. Such an approach is contrary to good governance. Eligibility rules should not be changed during ongoing competition, and any rule change must follow appropriate processes and should be based on scientific evidence. The IOC is committed to protecting the human rights of all athletes participating in the Olympic Games as per the Olympic Charter, the IOC Code of Ethics and the IOC Strategic Framework on Human Rights. The IOC is saddened by the abuse that the two athletes are currently receiving. The IBA’s recognition was withdrawn by the IOC in 2023 following its suspension in 2019. The withdrawal of recognition was confirmed by the Court of Arbitration for Sport (CAS). See the IOC’s statement following the ruling. The IOC has made it clear that it needs National Boxing Federations to reach a consensus around a new International Federation in order for boxing to be included on the sports programme of the Olympic Games LA28.
咱们现在并不知道她是不是有睾丸，如果她体检结果没有睾丸，或者换一个真的男性，自己去势做了太监，按你的逻辑，就是女人了？
顺便说一句，她在奥运会上雄激素水平没有超标，很有可能本来就没有睾丸。前面说看她裤裆的突起，绝对不是JJ。她来自穆斯林国家，这方面比你们只可能更加保守
惨，Jennifer Aniston被开除女籍了
我希望板上贴问IVF求bless的妈妈们没有进这个贴，否则真的被伤口撒盐了
以后女孩奥运会前得先生了孩子才能有资格竞争
我只是好奇，左棍大妈会允许这样人跟她一起洗澡？会允许这样长相的人跟自己孩子一起如厕？ 左棍连什么shi都能舔啊
那些都不能是女人，都不能自己生孩子，还能算女人吗
所以我说中国队一大半都得disqualify
这是美国，洗澡上厕所都不在一起
话说回来你让女儿和其它女孩洗澡，不怕人家是同性恋占你女儿便宜？
中国队里 有几个是当妈了的？
IBA president Umar Kremlev said Khelif was "proven" to have XY chromosomes 但具体用什么手段测的IBA不公布 而时至今日两位有争议的运动员没一个站出来澄清自己不是XY的，所以这事基本没跑了
https://www.sportingnews.com/us/olympics/news/imane-khelif-gender-eligibility-test-ioc-iba-championship/f36302ed5889c11046e5c704
我就问你愿意不愿意？ 你愿意不愿意这样人公开拥抱你女儿？ 你愿意不愿意这样人跟你女儿一个宿舍？
你们的脑子里，男女就是XX，XY决定的，前面什么睾丸都没关系。黑白思维。
不是这样的，因为女性在运动中是弱势，所以无论按哪种方法划分，只要有一条是男性，就应该去男性比赛。或者就是单独一个群体比赛
你不能因为他的雄激素不高就可以认定他的女性身份，这个太不客观，只能根据DNA来决定，这是科学和文明社会的标志
不是的。在我看来Imane是女人，但是这样的女人不应该参加以体力取胜的接触性竞赛。 不要把厕所、政治等事和体育竞技混为一谈。
她们去参加残奥会那不是碾压。。。对残疾人这种群体更不公平吧。。。另立项目挺好，问题是有没有足够的此类人士参加，搞不好谁去谁金牌。
这个可能真就是超级edge case。。 出生的时候没有男性的性器官，大部分细胞有xy染色体少部分是单x染色体的嵌合体（这种还有能自然受孕的），睾丸酮也在女性水平之内，你说是男的女的
不是xy决定，那什么决定？你太监了就是变成女人？
这种极少数现象，一些人宁可闭着眼睛说他们不存在，不存在就是不存在！
太监是男是女？ 太监可以参加女性拳击吗？
不用争论他是男性是女性，竞技体育比赛中参加不引起争议的不占便宜的类别就可以。因为按器官她是女，按染色体他是男，看他长相肌肉线条也是男，这种就是可以说是男也可以说是女，就参加男性比赛或其他类
就说不是主动做太监，男性如果是出事故伤了，没了外在器官，也是变成女人？
看染色体也不是男啊。。或者不是纯男。你这三个argument里面成立的只有长相肌肉线条是男了。。总不能说这人长得五大三粗的，看着像个男人就算男的吧，那不是更草率 说不定人家退役了跑去生娃呢。。那算男性生娃第一人么
因为拳协是俄国人掌管的，奥委会找借口与其切割，不让其管理奥运会拳击赛事，也不采取其规则。一切都是政治。 恶心的是以色列人可以参与奥运。奥委会都臭了。
既然不是百分百女的为什么参加女性比赛？他为什么不去参加男子比赛。不是占便宜是什么？
难道不就是染色体决定的？XXY他也是男的 XX即使有男性生殖器也是女的 不过XX长男性器官的没听说过
你这自己给自己立靶子啊。。啥叫百分百女的。。你能列出标准来总有满足你标准的edge case出现，在满足标准的范围内人家也认为自己是女的，为啥不能去参加女子比赛？
不认同这个观点。太监是后天人为的，和变性没区别，都是后天人为的。而这个女的是先天的，不管她是XY还是XX染色体。老天爷老祖宗（古今中外）对男女的叛变就是孩子出生后裤裆里看一下，带把儿，男，不带把儿，女。就这么简单。用染色体XY/XX判断有几个严重的缺陷，因为已经有例子XY的女性有女性生殖系统并生育。这是个假设和概率分布问题。要真用基因分性别，那性别还真不是男女两个Binary的发布，那多了去了。要这么说，我还真抬杠，以后奥运会只能板上著名的“有机娃”参赛，凡事吃非有机食品的“非有机娃”都不应该参赛？？？这个事情和这个运动员没关系（假设她没有后天人为变性）。错在奥委会的标准有问题。大家鞭尸这个运动员，不合理。
非常同意，文革不是会不会有2.0版的问题，而是一直就没离开过我们😁
无意冒犯您，只是单纯讨论问题，您出生的时候性别是您的父母测了您染色体才定的，还是看了下您的裤裆部位就确定了。要用染色体和基因，就不止男女两种性别了，可以有无数种性别！
这话就有点过分了，集点德吧，这个世界上因为种种疾病不能生孩子的女人多了，难道她们都不能算个女人？
凡是性别识别不清，不男不女，有争议的，一律参加男子比赛。
怀孕头三个月 做无创 DNA or 羊水穿刺 都能确定染色体是XX还是XY了 还看裆 您是50后吗
除了高龄产妇或者特殊基因病人群，谁会去做这个，尤其羊水穿刺还是流产风险的。像中国为了避免重男轻女流掉女婴，根本不给做性别鉴定
非抬杠，单纯好奇，如果用染色体判定性别为啥有无数种？不是只有三种？单纯xx为女性，单纯xy为男性，有若干x和y的组合体为跨性别 而跨性别就为非女性，不是很简单吗？还有啥其他组合？这里指只看染色体不看性器官判定性别的情况
你以为xx 和 xy 就决定男女了么。 决定男女的主要基因是SRY 这个大部分时候长在Y上，但是也可以长在X上。
你在中国？美国孕妇都查的
"XY,还有睾酮过高都是外界猜测的"
根据下面这篇报道，非外界猜测：
“Despite reaching the final of the World Championships in March 2023, Khelif was disqualified just before the bout for "medical reasons." In the weeks that followed, it emerged that Khelif was removed from the competition after drug tests confirmed high levels of testosterone. Following this incident, IBA president Umar Kremlev stated that these results proved that Khelif and other female athletes with elevated levels of testosterone carried male chromosomes.”
Who is Imane Khelif? Bio and controversial history of Algerian Olympic boxer at Paris 2024 | Sporting News https://www.sportingnews.com/us/boxing/news/imane-khelif-bio-algerian-olympic-boxer-paris-2024/44959db4dc011af9076a4aeb#:~:text=In%20the%20weeks%20that%20followed%2C%20it%20emerged%20that,with%20elevated%20levels%20of%20testosterone%20carried%20male%20chromosomes.
"XY,还有睾酮过高都是外界猜测的"
根据下面这篇报道，非外界猜测：
“Despite reaching the final of the World Championships in March 2023, Khelif was disqualified just before the bout for "medical reasons." In the weeks that followed, it emerged that Khelif was removed from the competition after drug tests confirmed high levels of testosterone. Following this incident, IBA president Umar Kremlev stated that these results proved that Khelif and other female athletes with elevated levels of testosterone carried male chromosomes.”
Who is Imane Khelif? Bio and controversial history of Algerian Olympic boxer at Paris 2024 | Sporting News https://www.sportingnews.com/us/boxing/news/imane-khelif-bio-algerian-olympic-boxer-paris-2024/44959db4dc011af9076a4aeb#:~:text=In%20the%20weeks%20that%20followed%2C%20it%20emerged%20that,with%20elevated%20levels%20of%20testosterone%20carried%20male%20chromosomes.
“这种绝对不能单纯定义为女性！是可以是难也可以是女，那有争议的情况下应该选择一个不会引起争议的类别去比赛，就是参加男性比赛。或者就是单独一个有性别争议的人自己比赛，别来祸害女性运动”
同意，有这种特殊情况的参加男子组没人有意见，除了运动员自己😁。 细分的话categories就多了，生物男女（biologic/genetic sex, 然后一群人争执定义）；trans male,；trans female； gender fluid/non-binary 非男非女自己选。。。
“太监是男是女？ 太监可以参加女性拳击吗？”
没记错的话，美国这边竞技性体育赛事组织的规定是如果男子变性成女性的医疗开始于青春期后，不能按女性性别参赛。因为肌肉骨骼已经发育接近于成年男子了，要想reverse成为女性的肌肉骨骼body composition是N年甚至一辈子要奋斗的事情。
太监如果青春期后才变太监，按规定就不能参加女子赛。
以后可以专门选这些XY染色体的阴阳人参加女子比赛。不过其他比赛也罢了，看着男大姐们在拳击比赛把一帮xx纯女人打得满脸是血哭爹喊妈还是膈应。
标准生物女性定义应该是到了一定年龄就能自然排卵受孕的那一类人😁，有没有生，想不想生完全另一回事。
当然会有医学例外，但到竞技赛场上就应该酌情考虑，不能简单划为女性
一龙的儿子 16岁做的变性手术， 所以她不能按女性性别参赛。。变性人一般一直服用雌激素， 参照金星。。这个人的男性外表太明显， 感觉他没有服用雌激素， 反而服用 testosterone了。。
所以XXY也是男性，只是有病的男性，但这也不是女性
正解
我怀孕做的是ultrasound，没有做任何DNA检测，也没羊穿，难道你的小孩做DNA检测和羊穿了？而且即使美国能做，其他国家也并不是都能做，中国就不给做，有什么不对吗
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https://x.com/TheQuartering/status/1819824835138142667
我至始至终都强调，有XY就是男性，去了势的太监也是男性，金星这种不好定义，但人家也没利用这个身份做伤害人的事，自己给自己定义是男是女无所谓
这说明，用眼睛来判断，不是百分百准确而已。难道你判断的方法不对，就可以说事实就不对？
这个人不就做了检测吗？要不然谁还知道他是xy还是xx？ 明明是已经做了检测，知道他是xy，还要狡辩因为小时候没有做，所以不能算？ 小时候当女孩儿，发现不是，这个对他自己来说是很痛苦的事情。这个是让人同情的事情。但同情归同情，并不该因为同情他，逼着让其他女性受不公平对待。
那要看你相信谁的信息了，IOC说没有实锤，拳联是Russian把持的，他们很巧合的是在这位阿尔及利亚选手战胜一名俄国选手之后，做了某种unspecified test，说她不合格，这个test到底是什么，没人知道，传的都是rumor，IOC用的标准是沿用里约和东京奥运会的相同标准，她合格属于正常参赛，IOC的主席说停止对运动员的hate speech
还真不是。Androgen insensitivity syndrome的人因为对雄激素不敏感，有全套女性生殖器官，表型也是女性。虽然染色体是XY，但医学上和社会生活中都认为是女性。
男女不完全靠xy 和xx 要看很多基因的表现，例如sry基因，这个大概率在y染色体上，也有可能在x染色体上，这个拳击手如果有女性生殖系统说明她y 染色体上可能没有SRY，那么她更偏向于女性的。 另外SRY基因虽然作用最大，但是也还有其他基因影响男女发育
请不要使用阴阳人这种有歧视性侮辱性的词语。请记住己所不欲，勿施于人啊。
看过NBC的报道，说是没有实锤。
所以这里说人家是XY染色体的也是没有证实的事情。
All athletes participating in the boxing tournament of the Olympic Games Paris 2024 comply with the competition’s eligibility and entry regulations, as well as all applicable medical regulations set by the Paris 2024 Boxing Unit (PBU) (please find all applicable rules here). As with previous Olympic boxing competitions, the gender and age of the athletes are based on their passport.
These rules also applied during the qualification period, including the boxing tournaments of the 2023 European Games, Asian Games, Pan American Games and Pacific Games, the ad hoc 2023 African qualifying tournament in Dakar (SEN) and two world qualifying tournaments held in Busto Arsizio (ITA) and Bangkok (THA) in 2024, which involved a total of 1,471 different boxers from 172 National Olympic Committees (NOCs), the Boxing Refugee Team and Individual Neutral Athletes, and featured over 2,000 qualification bouts.
The PBU used the Tokyo 2020 boxing rules as a baseline to develop its regulations for Paris 2024. This was to minimise the impact on athletes’ preparations and guarantee consistency between Olympic Games. These Tokyo 2020 rules were based on the post-Rio 2016 rules, which were in place before the suspension of the boxing International Federation by the IOC in 2019 and the subsequent withdrawal of its recognition in 2023.
We have seen in reports misleading information about two female athletes competing at the Olympic Games Paris 2024. The two athletes have been competing in international boxing competitions for many years in the women’s category, including the Olympic Games Tokyo 2020, International Boxing Association (IBA) World Championships and IBA-sanctioned tournaments.
These two athletes were the victims of a sudden and arbitrary decision by the IBA. Towards the end of the IBA World Championships in 2023, they were suddenly disqualified without any due process.
According to the IBA minutes available on their website, this decision was initially taken solely by the IBA Secretary General and CEO. The IBA Board only ratified it afterwards and only subsequently requested that a procedure to follow in similar cases in the future be established and reflected in the IBA Regulations. The minutes also say that the IBA should “establish a clear procedure on gender testing”.
The current aggression against these two athletes is based entirely on this arbitrary decision, which was taken without any proper procedure – especially considering that these athletes had been competing in top-level competition for many years.
Such an approach is contrary to good governance.
Eligibility rules should not be changed during ongoing competition, and any rule change must follow appropriate processes and should be based on scientific evidence.
The IOC is committed to protecting the human rights of all athletes participating in the Olympic Games as per the Olympic Charter, the IOC Code of Ethics and the IOC Strategic Framework on Human Rights. The IOC is saddened by the abuse that the two athletes are currently receiving.
The IBA’s recognition was withdrawn by the IOC in 2023 following its suspension in 2019. The withdrawal of recognition was confirmed by the Court of Arbitration for Sport (CAS). See the IOC’s statement following the ruling.
The IOC has made it clear that it needs National Boxing Federations to reach a consensus around a new International Federation in order for boxing to be included on the sports programme of the Olympic Games LA28.
奥委会说就按照护照上的性别确定男女，这下好日无边了。
美国现在可以自己定义护照性别，也允许transgender参加女子比赛，下届奥运会上美国必将碾压全世界，女子比赛也不用看了
那些说什么隔壁帖子恶意满满，跟民主党无关的来说说？