rollover 401k to Roth IRA

v
vt1000
楼主 (北美华人网)
准备把前雇主的401k转成IRA。发现有一个选项是可以直接转成Roth IRA。想问一下,先变成tranditional IRA再backdoor转成Roth, 和直接转成Roth,有什么区别吗? 补的税一样吗? 谢谢。
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c
changheruhailiu
准备把前雇主的401k转成IRA。发现有一个选项是可以直接转成Roth IRA。想问一下,先变成tranditional IRA再backdoor转成Roth, 和直接转成Roth,有什么区别吗? 补的税一样吗? 谢谢。
vt1000 发表于 2021-03-20 16:35

要交很多税吧。。。401k里的钱都是没有交过联邦和州所得税的
l
ljmdtc
401k如果是pretax的话转roth ira要补税不划算。 不如留着traditional ira
s
seven11
我给你大概讲讲区别,如果说错了请别人指教: 方案1: 1。 变成Traditional IRA 这一步不需要交税 2。 转Backdoor roth 第一,Backdoor roth有限制,每年6000。第二,Traditional IRA转Backdoor roth需要按Pro-rata交税,大体上讲就是如果你的Traditional IRA有pre-tax contribution,那么每次转钱的时候会按照pre-tax vs. after-tax的比例缴税,
方案2 直接变Roth IRA。所有的pre-tax contribution都要缴收入税。
其实还有其他方案
方案3:其实就是方案1做完第一步停。这个方案的坏处在于如果你自己想用after tax contribution做back door roth,还是得按pro-rata交税因为你已经有pre tax contribution在traditional IRA里面了 方案4:把之前的401k转到你现在雇主的401k 方案5:不动
方案4和5暂时都不用缴税,区别就在于你比较喜欢哪个401k里面的投资
c
centenario
我给你大概讲讲区别,如果说错了请别人指教: 方案1: 1。 变成Traditional IRA 这一步不需要交税 2。 转Backdoor roth 第一,Backdoor roth有限制,每年6000。第二,Traditional IRA转Backdoor roth需要按Pro-rata交税,大体上讲就是如果你的Traditional IRA有pre-tax contribution,那么每次转钱的时候会按照pre-tax vs. after-tax的比例缴税,
方案2 直接变Roth IRA。所有的pre-tax contribution都要缴收入税。
其实还有其他方案
方案3:其实就是方案1做完第一步停。这个方案的坏处在于如果你自己想用after tax contribution做back door roth,还是得按pro-rata交税因为你已经有pre tax contribution在traditional IRA里面了 方案4:把之前的401k转到你现在雇主的401k 方案5:不动
方案4和5暂时都不用缴税,区别就在于你比较喜欢哪个401k里面的投资

seven11 发表于 2021-03-20 17:23

没看懂,backdoor roth 是要公司提供才有这个选项吧?6000 的限制不是应该是 combined traditional IRA 和 ROTH 吗?
s
seven11
没看懂,backdoor roth 是要公司提供才有这个选项吧?6000 的限制不是应该是 combined traditional IRA 和 ROTH 吗?
centenario 发表于 2021-03-20 18:58

Backdoor Roth自己就可以搞,每年可以税后contribute 6000
Mega backdoor roth是需要公司提供选项的
l
ljmdtc
没看懂,backdoor roth 是要公司提供才有这个选项吧?6000 的限制不是应该是 combined traditional IRA 和 ROTH 吗?
centenario 发表于 2021-03-20 18:58

Mega backdoor(aftertax 401k -> Roth IRA)要公司提供选项。 backdoor(after tax ira -> Roth IRA)不需要公司支持。
$6000是指每年IRA contribution吧?和rollover或者backdoor应该没关系吧?
s
seven11
Mega backdoor(aftertax 401k -> Roth IRA)要公司提供选项。 backdoor(after tax ira -> Roth IRA)不需要公司支持。
$6000是指每年IRA contribution吧?和rollover或者backdoor应该没关系吧?
ljmdtc 发表于 2021-03-20 19:02

$6000确实是每年的IRA 上限,但是大部分人都超过了收入线,所以才叫backdoor roth IRA。用这种方法最终的目的是在收入超过IRS规定的上限的情况下还能存6000块roth IRA
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centenario
"A backdoor Roth IRA is not an official type of retirement account. Instead, it is an informal name for a complicated but IRS-sanctioned method for high-income taxpayers to fund a Roth, even if their incomes exceed the limits that the IRS allows for regular Roth contributions." GOOLE 上查到的, “the backdoor Roth has become an option for higher-income taxpayers who ordinarily couldn't contribute to a Roth.” 这里的backdoor ROTH 只是对收入超限的来说,不超限的走ROTH
g
gokgs
为什么不简单转成 rollover IRA 呢? 瞎折腾, 也不一定省税省钱。 pretax dollar grow together, and help you earn after tax dollar too.
s
seven11
为什么不简单转成 rollover IRA 呢? 瞎折腾, 也不一定省税省钱。 pretax dollar grow together, and help you earn after tax dollar too.
gokgs 发表于 2021-03-20 19:15

Rollover IRA 其实就是 Traditional IRA。转成这个的最大影响就是如果你还想make after tax contribution to roth IRA using backdoor,需要用pro-rata缴税,到时更复杂。
我个人觉得对于一般passive investor来说最好的方法其实是不动,或者转到现雇主的401K
s
seven11
"A backdoor Roth IRA is not an official type of retirement account. Instead, it is an informal name for a complicated but IRS-sanctioned method for high-income taxpayers to fund a Roth, even if their incomes exceed the limits that the IRS allows for regular Roth contributions." GOOLE 上查到的, “the backdoor Roth has become an option for higher-income taxpayers who ordinarily couldn't contribute to a Roth.” 这里的backdoor ROTH 只是对收入超限的来说,不超限的走ROTH
centenario 发表于 2021-03-20 19:12

你说的没错,但是这个收入上限比较低,很多华人很容易就超过了
For a Traditional IRA, for 2020 full deductibility of a contribution is available to active participants whose 2020 Modified Adjusted Gross Income (MAGI) is $104,000 or less (joint) and $65,000 or less (single); partial deductibility for MAGI up to $124,000 (joint) and $75,000 (single).
所以对于大部分华人来说是需要走backdoor Roth IRA的
g
gokgs
Rollover IRA 其实就是 Traditional IRA。转成这个的最大影响就是如果你还想make after tax contribution to roth IRA using backdoor,需要用pro-rata缴税,到时更复杂。
我个人觉得对于一般passive investor来说最好的方法其实是不动,或者转到现雇主的401K
seven11 发表于 2021-03-20 19:21

i put everything into rollover IRA, trade stocks and buy options. i never worry about tranditional and roth IRA, tried once, and then closed the account. do not want to keep different account, not worth it IMO.
s
seven11
i put everything into rollover IRA, trade stocks and buy options. i never worry about tranditional and roth IRA, tried once, and then closed the account. do not want to keep different account, not worth it IMO.
gokgs 发表于 2021-03-20 19:24

如果你个人收入没到IRS规定的IRA上限这么做可以。如果你已经到了,但是又没做backdoor roth IRA,you are missing out
g
gokgs
如果你个人收入没到IRS规定的IRA上限这么做可以。如果你已经到了,但是又没做backdoor roth IRA,you are missing out
seven11 发表于 2021-03-20 19:27

i do not know. I do not like put too much in 401K, as well as in IRA etc. the money you saved today could be just worth much less 20 or 30 years later.
l
ljmdtc
i do not know. I do not like put too much in 401K, as well as in IRA etc. the money you saved today could be just worth much less 20 or 30 years later.
gokgs 发表于 2021-03-20 19:30

你存进去了也是投资的啊
如果你月光那确实不用存401k,要不然你钱留着不存401k干嘛?after tax本金是可以无惩罚取出的,最坏情况下要用钱了拿出来也行,没损失