死亡率低是因为高峰前的宁静。等ICU超容了，对病人的支持治疗就不可能象平时那么精细，死亡率就会大大增加。 看当初武汉和中国其他城市死亡率比较就知道了。 欧洲国家还有两三周时间会到ICU饱和。如果现在不采取严格lockdown, 病人海啸一样涌来的情况会再现。 Belgium on brink of disaster as coronavirus surge fills up ICU beds By Ivana Kottasová and Niamh Kennedy, CNN Updated 7:34 AM ET, Tue October 27, 2020
(CNN)Belgium is on the brink of a coronavirus disaster as a top health official warned that the country could run out of intensive care beds in as little as two weeks. The country of 11.5 million people has reported on average more than 13,000 cases a day in the past week, according to the national public health institute Sciensano. The Covid-19 outbreak in Belgium is the second worst in Europe in terms of new cases per capita, after only the Czech Republic. Yves Van Laethem, Belgium's spokesperson for the fight against the coronavirus, warned that unless Belgians change their behavior, intensive care units will reach their capacity of 2,000 patients in 15 days. At a news conference Monday, Van Laethem said that 1,000 of the country's intensive beds are already being used, with total of 1,250 set to be occupied by the end of the week. Both hospital and intensive care admissions are doubling every eight days, he added.
比利时医护感染新冠没症状不能请假。人手严重不足。医疗系统在崩溃边缘。 https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/belgium-covid-hospitals-schools/2020/10/23/85358010-14a9-11eb-a258-614acf2b906d_story.htmlEurope Amid covid-19 surge in Belgium, doctors and nurses asked to keep working after testing positive BRUSSELS — Well into Europe's second wave of the coronavirus, so many Belgians are sick or quarantining that there aren't enough police on the streets, teachers in classrooms or medical staff in hospitals. In some hospitals, doctors and nurses who have tested positive but don’t have symptoms are being asked to keep working, because so many others are out sick with covid-19, the disease caused by the novel coronavirus. School principals are marshaling secretaries and parent volunteers to replace falling ranks of teachers. “We have runaway numbers in terms of contamination and a major issue is the risk of the collapse of the hospital system of our country,” the minister-president of Brussels, Rudi Vervoort, said Saturday as he announced a host of new restrictions. Unlike in the spring, there are enough masks and gowns to go around. But months of preparation haven’t been able to avert a shortage of people. And a decision by the national government to remove a mask mandate and loosen restrictions on social contacts this month contributed to an acceleration of the virus before being largely reversed in hard-hit areas since Friday.
Pradheep J. Shanker@Neoavatara Europe is in FAR worse shape than the US. And the US is a mess to begin with. The US has about 70k a day right now. Population adjusted, this is how other countries compare: Germany 60k Poland 87k Italy 94k Spain 120k France 250k Czechia 300k Belgium 373k 7:12 AM · Oct 27, 2020·Twitter Web App
比利时医护感染新冠没症状不能请假。人手严重不足。医疗系统在崩溃边缘。 https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/belgium-covid-hospitals-schools/2020/10/23/85358010-14a9-11eb-a258-614acf2b906d_story.htmlEurope Amid covid-19 surge in Belgium, doctors and nurses asked to keep working after testing positive BRUSSELS — Well into Europe's second wave of the coronavirus, so many Belgians are sick or quarantining that there aren't enough police on the streets, teachers in classrooms or medical staff in hospitals. In some hospitals, doctors and nurses who have tested positive but don’t have symptoms are being asked to keep working, because so many others are out sick with covid-19, the disease caused by the novel coronavirus. School principals are marshaling secretaries and parent volunteers to replace falling ranks of teachers. “We have runaway numbers in terms of contamination and a major issue is the risk of the collapse of the hospital system of our country,” the minister-president of Brussels, Rudi Vervoort, said Saturday as he announced a host of new restrictions. Unlike in the spring, there are enough masks and gowns to go around. But months of preparation haven’t been able to avert a shortage of people. And a decision by the national government to remove a mask mandate and loosen restrictions on social contacts this month contributed to an acceleration of the virus before being largely reversed in hard-hit areas since Friday.
医院已经超容。海牙救护车转圈儿开没法儿放下病人。比利时要求荷兰帮助接收一些病人，但是荷兰本身已经在往德国空运病人。 欧洲怎么这么快就到了这么惊悚的情况了？ Naomi O'Leary@NaomiOhReally Hospital capacity running out in multiple European countries, as forecast. Ambulances 'driving in circles' in the Hague, unable to discharge patients. Belgium asks NL to take in some patients, but Dutch hospitals are already airlifting patients to Germany, as they have no room.
今天刚出来的，新冠病愈后遗症之一：脑损伤 LONDON (Reuters) - People recovering from COVID-19 may suffer significant brain function impacts, with the worst cases of the infection linked to mental decline equivalent to the brain ageing by 10 years, researchers warned on Tuesday. https://www.reuters.com/article/health-coronavirus-brains-idUSKBN27C1SG
今天刚出来的，新冠病愈后遗症之一：脑损伤 LONDON (Reuters) - People recovering from COVID-19 may suffer significant brain function impacts, with the worst cases of the infection linked to mental decline equivalent to the brain ageing by 10 years, researchers warned on Tuesday. https://www.reuters.com/article/health-coronavirus-brains-idUSKBN27C1SG Seeking668 发表于 2020-10-27 14:27
医院已经超容。海牙救护车转圈儿开没法儿放下病人。比利时要求荷兰帮助接收一些病人，但是荷兰本身已经在往德国空运病人。 欧洲怎么这么快就到了这么惊悚的情况了？ Naomi O'Leary@NaomiOhReally Hospital capacity running out in multiple European countries, as forecast. Ambulances 'driving in circles' in the Hague, unable to discharge patients. Belgium asks NL to take in some patients, but Dutch hospitals are already airlifting patients to Germany, as they have no room. 平明寻白羽 发表于 2020-10-27 13:32
今天刚出来的，新冠病愈后遗症之一：脑损伤 LONDON (Reuters) - People recovering from COVID-19 may suffer significant brain function impacts, with the worst cases of the infection linked to mental decline equivalent to the brain ageing by 10 years, researchers warned on Tuesday. https://www.reuters.com/article/health-coronavirus-brains-idUSKBN27C1SG Seeking668 发表于 2020-10-27 14:27
群免现在基本可以证明失败 LONDON (Reuters) - Antibodies against the novel coronavirus declined rapidly in the British population during the summer, a study found on Tuesday, suggesting protection after infection may not be long lasting and raising the prospect of waning immunity in the community. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-britain-antibody-idUSKBN27C009
下图截取all age,0-14,15-44,45-64,65+从2020年第26周到第42周的几个欧洲国家数据。 不知道cdc有没有这样的数据网页？
https://www.euromomo.eu/graphs-and-maps/
欧洲主要看德国吧!!
德国是欧洲的中原地区, 是欧洲人口最多, 经济最重要, 市场最大的地方吧!!
占领了德国市场, 才能占领欧洲市场啊!!
无所谓了.
这种东欧的地方, 一般没人去.
以前去过 波兰的一个小城市,
看不到一个亚洲人和中国人.
中国人最胆小如鼠, 只敢去英国和美国,
东欧国家, 中国人一般不敢去.
那些ID自己绕在自己的逻辑里，他们的point是死亡率没有爆是因为感染的年轻人多。但是接着问，既然年轻人感染了大概率是没事的，那还怕什么？这些ID就silent了。
政府也很左是什么意思啊
英国是右派执政 德法都是中右政党执政 波兰是极右派执政
SO?
年轻人得病的变多 而且现在用药水平高太多了 春天的时候真的太惨了
死亡人数的绝对值也没有dramatically changed。日增一万的时候死一千和日增五万死一千，只能说明以前日增一万是测试不足，或者是现在死亡率下降，或者都有。
没死就ok？这是什么逻辑？不说得病的时候各种痛苦，花费的巨额费用，医护人员为救他们冒的巨大风险，还会传染给老弱病残等于杀人，就是好了后遗症也是很可怕的，这次疫情暴露出来的各种反智简直太可怕
后遗症有确切证据吗，那些感染的运动员名人好像都没事。
如果不影响经济当然可以一直关，关到病毒消亡。但是继续这么搞太伤经济会引起更大的问题。不是说这个病毒没关系，是说权衡利弊，不能只看感染率而重创经济。只看感染率的才叫反智。
法国怎么回事?他们是全面开放了?啥措施都没采取?法国感觉不大呀
感觉第二轮更难控制！好多人受够了！
Angry protests flared in at least two major cities in Italy on Monday night against a new round of government coronavirus restrictions https://reut.rs/31IH2EM
https://twitter.com/i/status/1321130789967335424
系统提示：若遇到视频无法播放请点击下方链接
https://twitter.com/i/videos/1321130789967335424
我们firm感染的两个, 老公公司的三个, 都没啥后遗症, 当然我是看表面哈, 精神抖擞和以前没差别
justwatching 发表于 2020-10-27 12:58
德国中右? 我笑而不语。
看当初武汉和中国其他城市死亡率比较就知道了。
欧洲国家还有两三周时间会到ICU饱和。如果现在不采取严格lockdown, 病人海啸一样涌来的情况会再现。
Belgium on brink of disaster as coronavirus surge fills up ICU beds
By Ivana Kottasová and Niamh Kennedy, CNN Updated 7:34 AM ET, Tue October 27, 2020
(CNN)Belgium is on the brink of a coronavirus disaster as a top health official warned that the country could run out of intensive care beds in as little as two weeks. The country of 11.5 million people has reported on average more than 13,000 cases a day in the past week, according to the national public health institute Sciensano. The Covid-19 outbreak in Belgium is the second worst in Europe in terms of new cases per capita, after only the Czech Republic. Yves Van Laethem, Belgium's spokesperson for the fight against the coronavirus, warned that unless Belgians change their behavior, intensive care units will reach their capacity of 2,000 patients in 15 days. At a news conference Monday, Van Laethem said that 1,000 of the country's intensive beds are already being used, with total of 1,250 set to be occupied by the end of the week. Both hospital and intensive care admissions are doubling every eight days, he added.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/belgium-covid-hospitals-schools/2020/10/23/85358010-14a9-11eb-a258-614acf2b906d_story.htmlEurope Amid covid-19 surge in Belgium, doctors and nurses asked to keep working after testing positive BRUSSELS — Well into Europe's second wave of the coronavirus, so many Belgians are sick or quarantining that there aren't enough police on the streets, teachers in classrooms or medical staff in hospitals. In some hospitals, doctors and nurses who have tested positive but don’t have symptoms are being asked to keep working, because so many others are out sick with covid-19, the disease caused by the novel coronavirus. School principals are marshaling secretaries and parent volunteers to replace falling ranks of teachers. “We have runaway numbers in terms of contamination and a major issue is the risk of the collapse of the hospital system of our country,” the minister-president of Brussels, Rudi Vervoort, said Saturday as he announced a host of new restrictions. Unlike in the spring, there are enough masks and gowns to go around. But months of preparation haven’t been able to avert a shortage of people. And a decision by the national government to remove a mask mandate and loosen restrictions on social contacts this month contributed to an acceleration of the virus before being largely reversed in hard-hit areas since Friday.
左右是按照国家里面的政党派别分的 默克尔的党派叫“基督教XX党” 你觉得是极左么？他们在德国的定位就是中右。
Educate yourself 不要夜郎自大 用美国标准衡量全世界
光比利时这政策一件事就知道多紧迫了
欧洲怎么这么快就到了这么惊悚的情况了？
不能同意更多，任何事情都没有绝对。一根筋的人说别人反智，其实自己才是反智
silent？年轻人得了不当回事，满世界瞎跑传染其他人，你也觉得无所谓是吧？ 而且你知道这个病的后遗症情况么？人类对它还有许许多多的未知，谨慎小心一点怎么了？ 反智起来真特么可怕
LONDON (Reuters) - People recovering from COVID-19 may suffer significant brain function impacts, with the worst cases of the infection linked to mental decline equivalent to the brain ageing by 10 years, researchers warned on Tuesday.
https://www.reuters.com/article/health-coronavirus-brains-idUSKBN27C1SG
汗死了。老年人就不是人吗？
年轻人感染了，不会传染给老年人吗？
西班牙流感也增加Alzheimer's disease risk。那一代人基本都感染过了吧，最后人人都得了Alzheimer's吗？现在关于新冠的研究，骗经费的太多了。
不需要一直关，只需要彻底的，短时间关。 彻底才是key.
拖拖拉拉的关，多长时间都没用。最后是疫情控制不下去，经济也发展不起来。不断的大量人口感染，恶性循环下社会资源浪费巨大，最终伤害经济根本.
Increased risk doesn’t equal 人人都得
说经济话题太大，也没多少人真正看得到大局，长期封锁带来大量心理疾病这也是很大的问题，尤其年轻人和小孩子，病毒对他们没杀伤力，他们又最需要social，人能忍不表示忍就没有问题。国内小孩子今年自杀的都特别多。心理疾病带来的影响也不是一年两年能解决的事情。其实我很害怕美国的心理疾病的增加，谁知道埋下的这些种子以后会发出什么芽？
社会方方面面这么不可控，人性这么复杂，只看病毒感染率死亡率，真的是反智。
那些人更加不会关心心理疾病的人群，他们关心的是后遗症，损伤心肺脑。
这是你说的，不是我说的。保护高危人群，逐步有序的reopen，让年轻人不再依靠救济金/失业金，逐步恢复经济，才是现在美国应对covid的大方向。
欧洲几乎所有国家都给小孩子到校上课了 现在就是把酒吧封杀了 比如晚上宵禁什么的
权衡利弊肯定要先砍掉酒吧这种地方吧 和战争年代一样 支持宵禁
同意，彻底关2个月，该发病的发病，该痊愈和死亡的都结束了，病毒就无处藏身了，问题就解决了 中国就是这样控制住的 半开不开，病毒一直在人群里接力传播，永远不能断绝，这就是美国和欧洲的悲剧
荷兰就是作 一个月前还说大家自愿戴口罩之类的 现在哭爹喊娘去求德国了
得多不谙世事的人才会有这种“病毒无处藏身”从而能结束疫情的期待？去好好学习一下吧，1918年开始的西班牙流感病毒到现在100多年了，从未离开过人类。人类想对病毒赶尽杀绝？自不量力。
一部分而已。
这个病是资源病，一旦人数上升超过医院的承受能力，死人数不是线性上升的
不要看还有多少Icu bed, icu bed可以扩容，icu级别的医护不能随便扩的
恶心. 老年人不是人? 就活该被你传染死掉?
我也笑而不語，笑你們這群人無知又自大得可笑。
你們八成是看到一些個別現象就強行推測整體，進而以為德法是偏左。 但是實際上這兩個國家的多數黨還真的就是偏右。
多做做功課吧~ 經過幾個月美國選舉風潮洗腦，洗到都變笨了？
沒血沒淚的人，還不知道有多少人會因此喪命。
現在更應該推廣的是有序控制，遵守防疫規則，慎重開放公共場所，一旦疫情失控就收緊，緩解就逐步開放。 其實美國在沒有BLM和選舉造勢之前，感覺還真就要控制住了，但沒辦法。
不過美國不像歐洲經過一次全面大開放，選舉造勢造成的傳播應該是不小，但可能影響沒有歐洲大規模開放旅遊的結果這麼恐怖，希望哪裡疫情都趕快緩解。
again，这是你说的，不是我说的。要恶心也是你恶心你自己。从来就没有人说老年人就活该感染死掉，现在说的难道不是在保护好高危人群的前提下，让年轻人去工作吗？不然，你养人家？你又不是the big guy，几个米几个米的拿！
在你们这些左派眼里，只要是在你们的右边都是极右。
德国哪个党是偏右的? 你能够举例吗？
我们都"无知",不知道你有"多知"?
一拖一，一个有经验的ICU 护士带一个普通病房护士
上面人家都給你舉例了還要多說嗎？ 無知就是無知，不需要狡辯。 越狡辯只會顯得越low、越沒下限。
你可以完全不認同別人的觀點，找出證據來證明別人是錯的， 用這種嘲諷口氣說話，不好意思，我看了就想說你無知又自大。 最討厭你們這種自以為是，用嘲諷別人的口氣說話，但是事實上對很多事只是一知半解的人。 連別人背景和動機都不知道，就隨便扣別人左派右派帽子，光這點就是你無知又自大的表現。 我就喜歡以其人之道還治其人之身，用同樣的態度嘲諷回去。
還德國哪個政黨是偏右的？ 你真以為滿世界都是左派？講究社會福利就是左派？ 不管再怎麼說，你們表現的就是既沒風度，自以為是，又只會給別人扣帽子。 基本上德國是多黨制聯合政府， 最大的基督教民主聯盟就是中間偏右， 另一大黨社民黨則是中間偏左， 目前實質上就是中間偏右佔優勢，所以是多數黨領袖默克爾擔任總理。
神经病一个。
你的左派定义就是发福利? 左派是什么?就是你们这帮混蛋，搞一言堂，搞得大家不敢说真话，只要指出某些人犯罪率高就是纳粹，只要说不同意打肤色牌打宗教牌就是极右。 就是你们这帮极左的antifa，非要将本土的宗教从法庭学校里拆除却让压迫妇女的宗教象征的头巾带进法庭学校。
就是你们这帮孙子，宁可为一个罪犯上街游行却对法国被伊斯兰极端犯罪分子谋杀的老师连一声叹息都没有。。。。
还要我列什么吗？ 对了， 还有好好的语言，非要搞gendersternchen? 懂吗？ 你是傻还是傻。 你就是傻x一个。
还有傻x， 告诉你， 你们的左派明目张胆的说，德国是属于左派和穆斯林的。
同意的
话说huaren是一月份就预示到这个结局了
看看得懂吗？ 下面的内容
推特上看来的录像。。。
德国联邦议院讨论女性在职场上的配额制， 一个女右派党员，德国选择党的议员，向绿党提问，绿党要求（公司--职场）要有女性配额，同时又要求大家接受，性别由自己自决: 男人如果认为自己是女人，那么他就是女人。
那么如果一个在职男性，他自认为是女人，这种情况下，他算是满足了女性配额制吗？
你们的左同行，没有正面回复问题，就是进行人身攻击，。
这就是你们左臂的品行。
法国大巴黎地区今天icu 90%被新冠占了，就是近十天内突然恶化，马克龙明晚八点讲话，要第二次封锁了，起码四周，宵禁已经不管用，而且这次是全国封锁。 小学，幼儿园继续开，初中未定。
你究竟懂还是不懂? 德国的经济体系就是 Soziale Marktwirtschaft。
懂吗你? 这个就是包括对贫穷的人进行经济上的帮助。 这就是你说的发福利。 但是我们不说是发福利，我们说是社会责任----对穷人的帮助，这个和左不左没关。
西方人不认同这办法，每个人有自己的想法，要发自己的声音，都要尊重，能咋办。
我真希望Merz能够当上基民党主席，那么还有可能可以走中庸之道。。。。 Basis 支持他， 但是。。。
LONDON (Reuters) - Antibodies against the novel coronavirus declined rapidly in the British population during the summer, a study found on Tuesday, suggesting protection after infection may not be long lasting and raising the prospect of waning immunity in the community.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-britain-antibody-idUSKBN27C009
你怕传染你自己social distancing啊，你不出家门谁传染你？ 你管别人干嘛
re，要关就要像国内那样下狠心关，不然拖拖拉拉，拖垮经济，一点效果没有
这也太太太天真了，属于完全脱离世界现实的自以为是的想法。全球每个角落能做到同步全封吗？非洲南亚中东南美到处都是，根本没有封的条件，欧美边界线长且复杂，人口依赖不发达地区输送，等等等因素。不可能一直拦住的。这个根本没用。
本来不想回复你，原因很简单， 你。。。"知识面"太广了。 （如果你认为我说你"知识面"太广生气的话，请参考你说我是夜郎自大。）
党派的名字,过去曾经是可以从他们的名字上看出左右立场。 但是地球是在转的，人的立场观点也会改变。
对于现在的党派，人们是不可能再从名字上去给他们定位，而是从他们的言行。
SPD, 德国最早之一的党，（其他的都已经消失了，）只有它至今仍然存在的工人党。 1998年红绿党上台，社民党的Schröder 和绿党的Fischer， 分别担任总理和外长。（按你说的，他们两党的定位是左派）
但是他们做出了连大右派 Kohl的基民党之前执政十几年都不敢做的事，就是大砍底层百姓的福利，削弱工人阶级的利益。。。 所以大批的社民党员离开转向绿党和左党。这些脱党的人，认为红党出卖灵魂，出卖了工人阶级的利益。 当时的财长Lafontaine, 他曾经是SPD 的主席， 也离开了SPD, 投入了 Die Linke. 社民党从一个德国最多党员的大众党变成三流党。
CDU， 基民党，正如 id Deutschland 2020 在后面讲的那样， 为了保证 执政政府的稳定， 不断的向左派妥协，不断地向绿党靠拢。
而他的姐妹党，CSU, 在今年初的时候还是比较传统的，现在也慢慢是墙头草了。
为什么说csu 基社党 是墙头草，因为内政部长 Seehofer 居然同意左臂的要求，查警察的所谓极端右派问题。 （原来他是不同意的） 但是不查antifa 和极端左派问题。 对极端的 伊斯兰连提都不敢提。
疫苗别抱太大希望，不过是给百姓的安慰剂，RNA病毒变异快，重复感染病例不少了，某88岁老人几个月感染三次，好消息是症状一次比一次轻。能不感染最好，随着应对经验增加，即便中招未必致命。