但是大部分呼吸已经困难的人还是希望能够得到帮助。这个时候什么是optimal的什么是inefficient的是一个完全不straight forward的事情,每人都觉得自己想的那个方面是最重要的,但是这个世界上有很多人,不同想法有很多。现在急于做结论对事情也许并没太大的帮助。事实就是大家都是一个trial and error的过程。
I suspect Newyork is repeating Chinese' fault. People in Wuhan China was dying crazy like today's Newyork. Later they found ventilator should be used to suck and clean COVID-19 patient's lung first, instead of push oxygen in. After the change, they dropped death rate immediately! Due to the infection, patient's lung is full of Interstitial fluid which blocks oxygen exchange. So patients can't breath even with ventilator. They die like drown. To save their life, must suck the liquid out first.
I suspect Newyork is repeating Chinese' fault. People in Wuhan China was dying crazy like today's Newyork. Later they found ventilator should be used to suck and clean COVID-19 patient's lung first, instead of push oxygen in. After the change, they dropped death rate immediately! Due to the infection, patient's lung is full of Interstitial fluid which blocks oxygen exchange. So patients can't breath even with ventilator. They die like drown. To save their life, must suck the liquid out first.
没法引用。 英文可不可以加上 Later when the first anatomy was done on a covid-19 body,and when they read the paper on it, they found ventilator should be used to suck mucous out and …… 还有一处小修改 Instead of pushing high pressure oxygen in They die like drowning in dry land
没法引用。 英文可不可以加上 Later when the first anatomy was done on a covid-19 body,and when they read the paper on it, they found ventilator should be used to suck mucous out and …… 还有一处小修改 Instead of pushing high pressure oxygen in They die like drowning in dry land 弹指芳华 发表于 4/5/2020 2:20:55 AM
这帖子里文盲还挺多。知不知道很多新冠发病和恶化很快,有时候就是一两个小时就从轻症到重症需要上呼吸机了。上呼吸机的50%可以熬过来,那是很大的数字。这又不是绝症,熬过了就活下来,熬不过就死,你说重要不重要?有谁会说到了重症不想要呼吸机的吗?其实有这个选择,进医院时医院会让签是否要resuscitation and intubate。另外跟没有见过呼吸机也没操作过的说一下,护士每隔一小段时间就帮病人吸痰,虽然没有自己(健康人)咳嗽好用,也不会让病人憋死...
文章里有数据,一百个人里能救33个,18个人里能救6个,最差的一组是武汉的数据,22个人里能救3个,那也值得了,本来医生每次送一个病人进ICU的时候知道成功率不是100%,难道就因为有可能失败就不救了吗? The largest study so far to look at mortality among coronavirus patients on ventilators was done by the Intensive Care National Audit & Research Centre in London. It found that among 98 ventilated patients in the U.K., just 33 were discharged alive. The numbers from a study of Wuhan, China, are even grimmer. Only 3 of 22 ventilated patients survived. And a study of 18 ventilated patients in Washington state found that nine were still alive when the study ended, but only six had recovered enough to breathe on their own.
Most coronavirus patients who end up on ventilators go on to die, according to several small studies from the U.S., China and Europe. And many of the patients who continue to live can't be taken off the mechanical breathing machines.
Re
呼吸机本身对这个冠状病毒重症患者没多大用,需要和其他措施并用才能抢救病人的生命
再说一遍,同样是中国已经踩过的坑了。。。似乎世界都不care中国的实践经验
这也没办法,中国的数据,新闻,。。。。什么都是假的,你让别人怎么信拿来直接用?
我还真回去看了一眼,9楼诅咒你啥了? 她哪句话打到你了?倒是你,上来就让人家聚众得病还重症,合着不同意你对呼吸机的看法就是会聚众得病还重症?
嘴上留点德。
re,部分川粉连这都洗,也不知道是眼睛坏了,还是脑子坏了,还是良心坏了
取其精华,去其糟粕,这是古人都明白的道理。也就一些没脑子的才会屁股决定脑袋,看到中国的就一棒子打死,包括这版上一些人
一些黑了心瞎了眼的川粉,有德才怪了
同怀疑。。。。。。
去看看美国cdc的指南,一半都是引用中国发表的数据,不是不愿意信吗?还引用中国的数据写指南?我觉得他们只是采用指责中国的数据不真实的方式来甩锅自己的防疫失败而已。
中国封城举世震惊,四万医护前去支援,武汉空城,全中国在中国最重要的节日期间空城的情况美国CIA会不知道?
可以把那个提前抛售股票的国会议员抓来采访一下,也可以把CDC两个月搞不出来一个检测试剂盒好好调查一下。
天啦,人的头脑不能这样简单吧……
是啊,这点很关键,有没有人认识一线的医生,能提醒一下。纽约的死亡率一直在攀升
Cuomo就是给纽约的伤口撒盐,呼吸机那么贵,又没起到挽救人命的作用,这些钱用来保护和预防或者开发疫苗更有效果。何况经济重创,家庭个人小型企业等都需要钱,本可以把钱用到实处。我记得看一个新闻说全日本才几千呼吸机而已,连联邦给纽约的一半都不到。
大家都各个渠道呼吁一下,认识医生的和医生说,不认识的上推@,发邮件,打电话,能多救一个也是好的,如果是这样的话,其他州可以好很多。但是我怕民主党的local 管理者会故意把事做坏
没人性的东西。还有给这种东西点赞的。
我呼吁没啥用,一月我都按板上MM的建议给议员发邮件了可惜人家不理,你行你上,我没意见。
的确很有可能很多人都是用呼吸机被痰给憋死的。。。。血的教训啊
你还别说,今天听说Oregon 州长说OR 控制的不错,要分些呼吸机给纽约。。。
已经借了140台了,我们州长谢了半天
版主也是有意思,我见一个举报一个都没人管啊
左臂州长不想让你们活,川粉想救也是力不从心啊, 好吧,你们跟紧你们州长市长指示就行了。
别吵架了,赶紧的帮着把消息传出去。我已经发了,大家都动起来,现在不能再相信美国人什么都知道了
你的英文版?大家可以考虑给各州医院都发下
I suspect Newyork is repeating Chinese' fault. People in Wuhan China was dying crazy like today's Newyork. Later they found ventilator should be used to suck and clean COVID-19 patient's lung first, instead of push oxygen in. After the change, they dropped death rate immediately! Due to the infection, patient's lung is full of Interstitial fluid which blocks oxygen exchange. So patients can't breath even with ventilator. They die like drown. To save their life, must suck the liquid out first.
如果有不通的地方,大家帮着改
谢谢层主,有没有官方消息可以转发?
我只找到这个说不能代替呼吸机。。。https://www.thepaper.cn/newsDetail_forward_6252554
看隔壁贴或者我上面发的,辟谣了。。。
跟chinatown有什么关系,又在暗戳戳搞歧视。
跟chinatown有什么关系,又在暗戳戳搞歧视。
你这矛盾啊。不把新冠当回事,封中国干吗?不刚跟中国签了合约吗?美国最早决定封,你说根本没当回事。主党说老川这么做就是歧视,顶着那么大压力,你说他不当回事,说不通啊。
你觉得他爱不爱钱?如果爱钱,为什么要封中国呢?
把新冠当回事 封了中国之后两个月做什么了?
是囤呼吸机还是囤ppe了?
两个月净在哪那打嘴炮说big flu了?然后病毒就消失了?
可真是当回事啊
讲黑心废物州长老有人要拿别人转移焦点。
是啊,你们得做好准备轻症不给药会拖成重症。难怪他不给药,这样需要呼吸机的人才会够多,他才不会被究责狮子大开口。
没错,早期不作为,等到疫情控制不住了再说点好听的做做姿态,然后变成自己的政绩,偏偏还有人吃这一套。亡羊补牢那些羊也追不回来了。为什么不肯未雨绸缪呢
The largest study so far to look at mortality among coronavirus patients on ventilators was done by the Intensive Care National Audit & Research Centre in London. It found that among 98 ventilated patients in the U.K., just 33 were discharged alive.
The numbers from a study of Wuhan, China, are even grimmer. Only 3 of 22 ventilated patients survived.
And a study of 18 ventilated patients in Washington state found that nine were still alive when the study ended, but only six had recovered enough to breathe on their own.
这种靠数据讲理的回帖他们不会理的。华人现在,too many opinions, too few facts
哈哈哈,你也觉得自己说的是💩吗 预防要下力气,重症的呼吸机也不能少,这不是common sense吗? 楼主你标题是在攻击纽约州长对呼吸机索求无度,自己理亏也不要歪楼哦
因为中国一边告诉全世界病毒不严重,一边把全世界的口罩都买走了,2.2 billions,
中国是在corner the market,
A Disgusting Country