------- The Coronavirus emergency in Italy continues to spread: in all regions there are people infected. And they are now very many: the cases are almost 4,000 ( 3,858, as of March 5 ), the recovered 414 (although it is necessary to understand each other, when it comes to "recovered": and it is good to read this piece ), and the deaths related to Coronavirus ( better not to speak of coronavirus deaths «and» we will soon understand why) they are 148 ( here the map ).
The age The ISS writes that the average age of the deceased patients is 81 years : and that there are 20 years of difference between the average age of the deceased and that of the virus positive patients. Most of the deaths - 42.2% - occurred in the age group between 80 and 89 years; 32.4% of the deaths were between 70 and 79; 8.4% were between 60 and 69; 2.8% between 50 and 59 and 14.1% over 90 years. Women who died after contracting the virus are older than men. The median age for women is 83.4, the median age for men is 79.9. 这里我加一句：注意不是说50岁以下不会死。这几天有意大利从疫区ICU的采访报道，年轻人有在ICU的。从2月21日意大利开始20个阳性爆发到现在时间还不久，年轻人还在撑着，先死的是老年人。
Sex The majority of patients who died after testing positive for Coronavirus are men. The pre-existing pathologies In more than two thirds of the cases, coronavirus deaths had three or more pre-existing pathologies: the average number of pathologies observed is 3.4. More precisely: 15.5% of the sample had no pathologies, or had only one; 18.3% had 2; 67.2% had 3 or more pathologies. Hypertension was present in 74.6% of the sample, followed by ischemic heart disease (70.4%) and diabetes mellitus (33.8%). Note: Coronavirus, transmission occurs even after the symptoms end
-----------------https://www.corriere.it/cronache/20_marzo_06/coronavirus-ultime-notizie-italia-mondo-43a06fd6-5f7b-11ea-96d2-d1c7db9c0ec3.shtml 150 family doctors infected «We already have about 150 family doctors in quarantine, in isolation or hospitalized, in various Italian provinces. And given the difficulty, at this moment, of finding who replaces them, for each of them there are potentially about 1,500 citizens without health reference points in the area. That is over 200,000 throughout Italy ". To tell ANSA is Silvestro Scotti, secretary of the Federation of General Practitioners (Fimmg) ----------------
This is the data collected yesterday. The number is changing all the time. But you can see the ICU ratio is around 10%.
... 769 more cases than on Wednesday 4 March. Of these, 148 died (41 more than yesterday) and 414 recovered (+138). Currently there are 3,296 positive subjects: the count rises to 3,858 - as mentioned above - if the dead and healed are also included in the calculation.
All 20 regions are involved. Here the map updated with the latest data.
There are 1,790 patients hospitalized with symptoms (+444); 351 are in intensive care (+56), while 1,155 are in fiduciary home isolation (+90).
ICU ratio 351/3296 = 10.6% ------- Read: The undertaking of an intensive care created in 24 hours: this is how it is done https://milano.corriere.it/notizie/cronaca/20_marzo_06/policlinico-san-donato-una-terapia-intensiva-creata-24-ore-ecco-come-si-fa-7065b67c-5f9c-11ea-96d2-d1c7db9c0ec3.shtmlCreate an intensive care in 24 hours. It is the "miracle" that is being repeated in many Lombard hospitals to meet the demand for beds generated by Covid-19. Maria Teresa Cuppone, medical director of the Irccs Policlinico San Donato, explains how a ward is set up in less than a day. Doctor, why do public or private hospitals like you have to reorganize? «There is a great need for ICU beds. A good number of virus positive patients can develop respiratory failure: in this case they must be hospitalized in these wards. The Region has given us clear indications on how to reorganize ourselves ».
Behind the choices of politics there are numbers to think about. Thursday's latest updates give 2,251 swab positive cases for Lombardy, 1,169 hospitalized patients, 244 in Intensive Care, 98 died. It does not end here. The commitment of all of us called to responsibly follow the measures useful to stop the virus race, among children who do not go to school and prohibition of overcrowding, serves to avoid the peak of infections. The estimate, for Lombardy only , is eight thousand new hospitalizations by March 22, 1,250 of which are serious and 400 in intensive care. These forecasts are elaborated on mathematical models by the experts of the Crisis Unit which are likely to come true if containment measures fail. They are not data that should alarm us, but they are important to guide us in our daily choices: everyone must limit contagion opportunities as much as possible and who is elderly (or frail) must remain at home. Hence the need to increase the reception capacity of the health system. 200 new posts are needed in intensive care, 100 in sub-intensive care, 150 in pulmonology, 100 in infectious diseases. Hence also the recommendation to self-isolation of all symptomatic: "If you have a fever stay at home!", Is the invitation addressed to each of us. It seems like a trivial recommendation but obviously, if it continues to be repeated, it is because there is a doubt that too many do not follow it. https://milano.corriere.it/notizie/cronaca/20_marzo_06/coronavirus-milano-curva-epidemiologica-previsioni-ottomila-contagi-picco-evitare-entro-22-marzo-1ca8d67e-5f18-11ea-bf24-0daffe9dc780.shtml
Some western Europeans assumed that men are more social active than female in China and Iran to explain it. Then the status in Italy prove the assumption wrong.
I am more keen on ACE2 receptor expression theory.
The undertaking of an intensive care created in 24 hours: this is how it is done Create an intensive care in 24 hours. It is the "miracle" that is being repeated in many Lombard hospitals to meet the demand for beds generated by Covid-19. Maria Teresa Cuppone, medical director of the Irccs Policlinico San Donato, explains how a ward is set up in less than a day. Doctor, why do public or private hospitals like you have to reorganize? «There is a great need for ICU beds. A good number of virus positive patients can develop respiratory failure: in this case they must be hospitalized in these wards. The Region has given us clear indications on how to reorganize ourselves ». At San Donato there is already an intensive therapy. Wasn't that enough? “No, because other uninfected seriously ill patients were hospitalized there. Having to provide fast support, we could not empty that department or create a separate area for virus positives. So we thought of setting up a resuscitation in a new operating block that had just received authorizations from the ATS (ex ASL, ed ) ". How do you turn an operating room into a resuscitation? «We need qualified personnel and equipment. For the first, the offices carried out an internal investigation. Specific skills are required in a resuscitation. A census was made of suitable nurses, for example those working in operating theaters or in hemodynamics. For doctors, we turned to intensivists. We are not talking about redundant staff, but who are normally employed in the planned activities which are now greatly reduced for emergencies ". And where did you get the equipment? "In intensive care, respirators are essential, because patients have to be intubated. We have made a census of those already present, others have been ordered. The clinical engineering office took care of this. And then they had to find drugs, aids and also review the paths of doctors and nurses who enter and leave the newborn resuscitation ». How long does it take? «Less than a day, thanks to everyone's collaboration and non-stop work. On Wednesday morning I informed the Region unofficially that we were moving and we were immediately told to request patients. In the afternoon the task force led by Antonio Pesenti of the Policlinico sent us the first patients ». For a while now you will be calm. "In no way. The six seats created on Wednesday are already all occupied, we plan to set up two more but we need a few days. One nurse is needed for every 2 ICU beds. We live almost for the day, tomorrow another request could come ». For example? «There are not only resuscitations. We have dedicated 40 beds to suspicious or positive, but not serious, patients. We may have to create new reception areas for those who arrive at the Goddess ». How many and which San Donato specialists are involved? «The Policlinico has 250/300 structured doctors and about 400 nurses. I would say that 30% is dedicated to coronavirus. We train staff, but we are already trained to manage complex patients, having departments such as cardiac surgery and vascular surgery. For now, the most busy are the intensivists and specialists in the medical area. I believe that sooner or later we will also involve surgeons. We are at war and we fight ».
Coronavirus Milan: sick doctors, departments under stress. Hunt 500 doctors and a thousand nurseshttps://milano.corriere.it/notizie/cronaca/20_marzo_05/dottori-ammalatireparti-sotto-stresscaccia-500-medicie-mille-infermieri-c346dd26-5ea7-11ea-bf24-0daffe9dc780.shtml A need of 1,500 between doctors and nurses. And the request from the government for simplified procedures for fast hiring. The growth of coronavirus infections in Lombardyit does not stop: spaces and personnel are needed to treat the sick, in particular the most serious ones who must be hospitalized in intensive care. The first challenge is to find specialists: intensivists, pulmonologists, infectious disease specialists and nurses. For the latter category, the April degrees were brought forward to March. In this way, the Department of Health thinks that it can count on 350 new levers of the thousand or so that it will need in the coming weeks. As for doctors, a requirement of 500 people is calculated. Where will they come from? The commissioner Giulio Gallera recalls the military health personnel already sent to the Lombard hospitals and asks the government for help: "We need economic incentives and the possibility of making on-call hiring and quick competitions". A support then comes from private health. A San Raffaele team two days ago went to the rescue of their colleagues in Lodi and four patients were transported to via Olgettina. More specialists are needed not only because they increase theCovid-19 patients , but also because a good portion of the total infected (12 percent yesterday) belongs to the healthcare world. The virus, Gallera explains, spread among white coats especially in the hospitals of Codogno, Lodi, Cremona and Alzano Lombardo in the first days of the epidemic. In addition to the staff problem, there is an urgent need for space. Intensive care yesterday welcomed 42 more people. Gallera explains that for the resuscitation "we have recovered another 30 beds", which add up to the 827 already present. Of these 209, they are occupied by coronavirus-positive patients, but it must be taken into account that other pathologies may require resuscitation hospitalization. Different strategies are in place to keep up with the increase in infections. Work is underway to set up beds in the operating blocks, which are underutilized in these days for the reduction of ordinary activities. «Up to three places can be obtained from each block». But we also proceed with "structural works" which will take a few weeks to convert some spaces. The medical wards are also being transformed into pulmonology. Here patients, thanks to the use of machines that help in breathing, they can be treated to delay or reduce transfers in resuscitations. And then the departments of sub intensive care and infectious diseases are used.
大家很多人问为什么意大利这么重。
这个原因多方面的，我看这个新闻媒体也有问这个问题，现在有一些potiential issue
1 意大利老龄化严重 仅次于日本
2 意大利要求医院遇到不明流感一定要test&protect。但是接诊patient1的医院没有follow protocol导致院内交叉感染发生之后，才确诊意识到问题严重性。而交叉感染的老年病人很快就去世了，抢救的window太小。血淋淋的教训告诉我们test的重要性。patient1社交活跃只是导致virus spread广泛，医疗交叉感染才是critical reaosn. （想象下一个在医院里面看医生的癌症患者，可能第二天去化疗，然后spread给所有化疗的人，里面有老人院的老人，然后。。。精准打击高危人群）。
3 意大利严格的把所有死亡人数都报了。考虑到意大利现在的带病人数很多。有一定percentage的人并不少“死于新冠”，而是的确要死了，并且尸体有新冠。
4 意大利有motivation多报告。意大利有地区自治传统，所以各地都在测试争取更多资源。同时向欧盟争取资源。
关于病毒的来源/种类
有报道米兰医院已经分离出来2类新冠病毒。说明疫区有两类都在流行。
根据病毒基因测序，更倾向于意大利的病毒来自于德国巴伐利亚的爆发。就是欧洲第一例，那个上海女员工去开会导致一个公司中招的那次。大家可以看到慕尼黑和米兰隔阿尔卑斯山相望。这和在意大利北部滑雪区爆发的现象一致。
-------
The Coronavirus emergency in Italy continues to spread: in all regions there are people infected. And they are now very many: the cases are almost 4,000 ( 3,858, as of March 5 ), the recovered 414 (although it is necessary to understand each other, when it comes to "recovered": and it is good to read this piece ), and the deaths related to Coronavirus ( better not to speak of coronavirus deaths «and» we will soon understand why) they are 148 ( here the map ).
The age The ISS writes that the average age of the deceased patients is 81 years : and that there are 20 years of difference between the average age of the deceased and that of the virus positive patients. Most of the deaths - 42.2% - occurred in the age group between 80 and 89 years; 32.4% of the deaths were between 70 and 79; 8.4% were between 60 and 69; 2.8% between 50 and 59 and 14.1% over 90 years. Women who died after contracting the virus are older than men. The median age for women is 83.4, the median age for men is 79.9. 这里我加一句：注意不是说50岁以下不会死。这几天有意大利从疫区ICU的采访报道，年轻人有在ICU的。从2月21日意大利开始20个阳性爆发到现在时间还不久，年轻人还在撑着，先死的是老年人。
Sex
The majority of patients who died after testing positive for Coronavirus are men.
The pre-existing pathologies
In more than two thirds of the cases, coronavirus deaths had three or more pre-existing pathologies: the average number of pathologies observed is 3.4. More precisely: 15.5% of the sample had no pathologies, or had only one; 18.3% had 2; 67.2% had 3 or more pathologies. Hypertension was present in 74.6% of the sample, followed by ischemic heart disease (70.4%) and diabetes mellitus (33.8%).
Note:
Coronavirus, transmission occurs even after the symptoms end
https://www.corriere.it/salute/malattie_infettive/20_marzo_05/chi-sono-morti-positivi-coronavirus-italia-787076ba-5f18-11ea-bf24-0daffe9dc780.shtml
-------------------
意大利是欧洲老龄化最严重的国家，在世界上仅次于日本位居第二，每5个意大利人中就有一人的年龄达到或超过65岁。不过，意大利人普遍认为真正意义上的老 年人应该年过76岁，而61岁至76岁这一年龄层的群体被称为“新老年”。总体上，意大利老人过得很潇洒。
-----------------https://www.corriere.it/cronache/20_marzo_06/coronavirus-ultime-notizie-italia-mondo-43a06fd6-5f7b-11ea-96d2-d1c7db9c0ec3.shtml
150 family doctors infected
«We already have about 150 family doctors in quarantine, in isolation or hospitalized, in various Italian provinces. And given the difficulty, at this moment, of finding who replaces them, for each of them there are potentially about 1,500 citizens without health reference points in the area. That is over 200,000 throughout Italy ". To tell ANSA is Silvestro Scotti, secretary of the Federation of General Practitioners (Fimmg)
----------------
This is the data collected yesterday. The number is changing all the time. But you can see the ICU ratio is around 10%.
... 769 more cases than on Wednesday 4 March. Of these, 148 died (41 more than yesterday) and 414 recovered (+138). Currently there are 3,296 positive subjects: the count rises to 3,858 - as mentioned above - if the dead and healed are also included in the calculation.
All 20 regions are involved. Here the map updated with the latest data.
There are 1,790 patients hospitalized with symptoms (+444); 351 are in intensive care (+56), while 1,155 are in fiduciary home isolation (+90).
ICU ratio 351/3296 = 10.6%
-------
Read: The undertaking of an intensive care created in 24 hours: this is how it is done
https://milano.corriere.it/notizie/cronaca/20_marzo_06/policlinico-san-donato-una-terapia-intensiva-creata-24-ore-ecco-come-si-fa-7065b67c-5f9c-11ea-96d2-d1c7db9c0ec3.shtmlCreate an intensive care in 24 hours. It is the "miracle" that is being repeated in many Lombard hospitals to meet the demand for beds generated by Covid-19. Maria Teresa Cuppone, medical director of the Irccs Policlinico San Donato, explains how a ward is set up in less than a day.
Doctor, why do public or private hospitals like you have to reorganize?
«There is a great need for ICU beds. A good number of virus positive patients can develop respiratory failure: in this case they must be hospitalized in these wards. The Region has given us clear indications on how to reorganize ourselves ».
Behind the choices of politics there are numbers to think about. Thursday's latest updates give 2,251 swab positive cases for Lombardy, 1,169 hospitalized patients, 244 in Intensive Care, 98 died. It does not end here. The commitment of all of us called to responsibly follow the measures useful to stop the virus race, among children who do not go to school and prohibition of overcrowding, serves to avoid the peak of infections. The estimate, for Lombardy only , is eight thousand new hospitalizations by March 22, 1,250 of which are serious and 400 in intensive care. These forecasts are elaborated on mathematical models by the experts of the Crisis Unit which are likely to come true if containment measures fail. They are not data that should alarm us, but they are important to guide us in our daily choices: everyone must limit contagion opportunities as much as possible and who is elderly (or frail) must remain at home.
Hence the need to increase the reception capacity of the health system. 200 new posts are needed in intensive care, 100 in sub-intensive care, 150 in pulmonology, 100 in infectious diseases.
Hence also the recommendation to self-isolation of all symptomatic: "If you have a fever stay at home!", Is the invitation addressed to each of us. It seems like a trivial recommendation but obviously, if it continues to be repeated, it is because there is a doubt that too many do not follow it. https://milano.corriere.it/notizie/cronaca/20_marzo_06/coronavirus-milano-curva-epidemiologica-previsioni-ottomila-contagi-picco-evitare-entro-22-marzo-1ca8d67e-5f18-11ea-bf24-0daffe9dc780.shtml
🔥 最新回帖
其实应该很多人知道吧，意大利制造只是个地点而已
都点什么赞啊？ 免疫系统没有那么笨？是什么就是什么！
🛋️ 沙发板凳
I will do a update later.Yes it is too early but the status is still very useful.
好像WHO的report里有说男的死亡率在4点几，女的是2点几。我原来觉得是中国男的抽烟的很多，肺状态不如女的，现在看来不一定。
Hospital in Milan has already separated both kind of virus from samples in Italy. Now there is two "brand" of Cov-19 spreading in Italy.
那他们有没有两种分别占多少的数据啊？
Some western Europeans assumed that men are more social active than female in China and Iran to explain it. Then the status in Italy prove the assumption wrong.
I am more keen on ACE2 receptor expression theory.
I have not found. It is not very easy to read Italy news I have to rely on Google Translate.
They have a lot of information.
Recommand this site to you https://www.corriere.it/
中国感染率差不多，死亡率有差。
It did not give any explanation in the news. I only see the status update.
But it aligned with some status finding in China as well
P.S : Italy is very 老龄化
免疫系统功能不行。肥胖也是，炎性因子在体内本身就多。
很早(还只在中国蔓延的时候)，就有谣言说有两种病毒。看来谣言还真是遥遥领先的预言啊。
你看看伊朗和意大利的情况
对，那个被撤职的南宁卫健委主任，说的alpha就是S，beta就是L。
武汉跟湖北的卫健委主任害死这么多任命都只是免职，这个南宁的就因为一条微信就撤职了，说明他泄露的肯定是真信息啊
RNA变异快，传着传着就有某些位点的核酸变异，变的多了就会造成致死性，传染率的改变。
就是不知道他们中亚裔有多少，还是都是白人和其他族裔
...........Both Italy and Iran are mostly not Asian.....
不是两种病毒，是两种分型，而且两个分型之间区别很小，甚至不如一些分型内部变异的区别大。
Yes it is true
租的装备？
现在的西雅图纽约也很让人害怕
武汉前期出现大量医疗挤兑。大家都知道有人在家去世，有人在医院到死没等到试剂盒，以病毒性肺炎为死亡原因。这些人都未记录在统计数字中。当然自己好的也没被扫出来记录。但是死亡率应该比3.7%高。曾经一度只测住院的（也是忙不过来）死亡率百分之十几。美国感觉在走武汉的老路。经过了这1～2月，我不知道他们flu的信息哪里来的，应该在1%以下的死亡率哪里来的。
我也不是专业人士，但是Influenza也会变异，所以打疫苗也不能保证就不被传染
https://www.reddit.com/r/Coronavirus/comments/feeh6p/experts_tear_apart_claims_coronavirus_has_split/
smoking
意大利至少还能lockdown，美国不可能吧 个人觉得，美国只能更糟
RNA病毒就是变异快啊。流感疫苗也就30%左右的有效率。最可怕的是你注射了某种流感疫苗，体内产生了对抗某型流感的B细胞，如果你不幸中了其他类型的流感，体内免疫系统会倾向继续产生原来的那种B细胞（其他类型流感和你免疫的很像，但有足够的变异）然后你就悲剧了，会很重，因为你的免疫系统被病毒骗了没有产生针对他的特定抗体。所以有人会发展成肺炎住院甚至死亡。
雪场的人口密度巨高啊。。那些换衣间/租设备的地方/餐厅/厕所，到处都是乌泱泱挤满了人。。。。。
而且因为需要暖气，很多室内环境的通气并不好。。。
这个太可怕了……
武汉的数据你也信。意大利死的这些人大多数都不会被包含在武汉报的数据里
没有集中在某地爆发，没有医疗挤兑。江苏600多也没死人。
前段时间传的ACE2感染未必准确了
我为啥不信，实际数据只会高不会低。死亡率3.7%怎么也不是flu是我的结论。
这样理解可以吗： 如果本身身体不错的话， 不要打疫苗， 宁愿让自己的身体去fight 病毒？
正解。所以乱打流感疫苗不是什么好事，还是要靠个人的免疫系统对抗病毒。
疫苗的靶向性强，但病毒会变异，疫苗产生的不对症的抗体反而会误导免疫系统，造成不可挽回的后果。
德国爆发的晚，传染的人还没到重症期，所以死亡率还没上来，等再过10天左右，就差不多了。
德国这次爆发全部是从意大利传染过来的
就是这么回事。免疫系统包含天生和自适应两块。
吞噬细胞吞了病毒(天生这块起作用)，
然把病毒信息传递给自适应免疫这块，
产生相应的抗体，最终消灭病毒。
那这么说西雅图湾区真的很危险啊，大概率会发生医疗挤兑吧？昨天看到西雅图口罩告急，口罩只能给病人用，医护人员只能不戴口罩裸奔，太可怕了！
嗯嗯，是还要再等一段时间，也可能德国老龄化不严重，年轻人还能挺一段时间，最近德国病例也蹿升挺快的
记得援助武汉的上海华山医院陈澍教授讲过，他们管的是重症病房，到了武汉十天，前八天没有一个活着出来的。。
刚开始呗，还没来得及死，等几周看吧
大统领还在说啊。
就是。作孽啊。
人家还嫌弃中国3.x%的死亡率太高，应该在1%以下。
看微信上的信息说，意大利的奢侈品很多是温州人做的，大家都心知肚明，所以这次被感染，没有宣扬是被谁传染的。问题就是如果说了真实情况，大家明白了奢侈品牌是中国人做的，对意大利的品牌是很大打击。
是的，真是打牙和血吞了，自己反倒成了疫情发源地
哪里看出来种族歧视了啊？
你说的是人话？
之前看新闻说1号病人接触的从中国回来的是白人啊，测试是阴性
后来确认是华人了？