Not only that, she is also aiming to improve her writing here. The correct gramma should be"know much less ... than I do" instead of using " than me". I am so picky that I have to point it out....
MM, are you coming here for improving your debate skill?Happyapple123 发表于 2015-12-10 15:10 PM
Richard Sanders写过一篇统计分析角度的文章,用数据说明AA其实对黑人不好,他们被低标准录取进了好的学校,反倒GPA垫底,容易退学,找不到工作……当然是争议很大也很容易被驳斥,但不能否认非常interesting. weiweilt 发表于 12/10/2015 5:32:00 PM
最高法justice也表明了类似的观点,结果被左派叫做"racist". Harry Reid, John Lewis assail 'racist' Scalia comments. Scalia was referring to a brief filed in the case that discussed an academic proposition called "mismatch theory."
"I'm just not impressed by the fact that the University of Texas may have fewer (African-Americans)," Scalia said, in part. "Maybe it ought to have fewer. And maybe some -- you know, when you take more, the number of blacks, really competent blacks, admitted to lesser schools, turns out to be less."
Sometimes people are unqualified because they don't work hard enough. As we discussed, the solution should be concerned with public k-12, but not lowering the bar. The government could offer tutoring, better teaching resources to kids in need, but should not just have different admission standards based on ethnicity.
The means to help people in lower hierarchy of the society is not to lower the bar of entrance for them, but to provide more assistance and resources to improve their competency. Is the mission of higher education achieving the diversity unconditionally? There should be a balance. That is why I said "blindly". Mobilizing more efforts in Public k-12 education for some people will be better than just lowering the bar of college entrance, in my idea, to address this social issue.
Pelosi calls on Scalia to recuse himself from discrimination cases He said, according to audio released on Friday, "there are those who contend that it does not benefit African-Americans to get them into the University of Texas where they do not do well, as opposed to having them go to a less-advanced school, a less -- a slower-track school, where they do well."
He also added "one of the briefs pointed out that most of the black scientists in this country don't come from schools like the University of Texas."
Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid denounced Scalia's comments as "racist" on Thursday, and longtime civil rights leader Rep. John Lewis of Georgia questioned whether he could remain impartial in the case currently before the court.
AA 在美国现在争议很大,美其名曰照顾 minority 考虑 diversity, 实际上只照顾某一个特定肤色,亚裔同样是 minority 却深受打击。当初建立AA的时候,黑人不能跟白人上一样的学校,过一样的生活,AA有它的现实意义。可是几十年过去了,早已时过境迁,AA已经成为实际上的种族歧视。
有兴趣的,可以狗一下 University of Michigan law school reverse discrimination. 这个 case里,Supreme court 明确表示种族不可以在录取过程中影响太大, 支持密歇根州禁止大学用种族作为录取标准,并直接判定 racial quota违宪。 http://fox17online.com/2014/04/22/u-s-supreme-court-upholds-michigan-ban-on-affirmative-action/
The term "affirmative action" was first used in the United States in "Executive Order No.10925",[6] signed by President John F. Kennedy on 6 March 1961, which included a provision that government contractors "take affirmative action to ensure that applicants are employed, and employees are treated during employment, without regard to their race, creed, color, or national origin."[7] In 1967, gender was added to the anti-discrimination list.
不过现在AA已经成为了 reverse discrimination 的 代名词 ,尤其是大学录取过程中,专门用来偏袒黑人,打压白人和亚裔,早已违背了 without regard to race, color 的初衷。
美国是 common law, 也就是法律的制定和实施都不可以违背 common sense, 要具体事件具体分析,比较灵活和易于调整。不管 AA 初衷如何,如果它的具体实施违背了初衷和宪法,带来新的歧视,给社会带来新的不公平,那么它的废除只是时间问题。同样是 common law 的英国就不搞 AA,只搞 positive action, 也就是给弱势群体提供 equal opportunity 但是不降低对他们的要求,跟我们楼上很多人的观点一致,值得借鉴。奴隶制废除了,种族隔离废除了,随着越来越多的anti reverse discrimination 案件引起关注,我对在有生之年看到 AA 的废除持乐观态度。
远的不说,就事论事你应该看看为什么fisher vs ut的case scotus没在2012解决,为啥现在又被搬出来。为什么历史上有通过scotus sue过学校对白人反歧视的两个著名case但这两个case的判决又如此contradictory。
好了,扣大盖帽的回复您就不必了。各走各路,各找各妈,have a nice day
但是AA就没道理。明明就是种族歧视。
MM, are you coming here for improving your debate skill?
要公平就把公立中小学搞好一点啊,让他们有能力去上大学
最高法justice也表明了类似的观点,结果被左派叫做"racist".
Harry Reid, John Lewis assail 'racist' Scalia comments.
Scalia was referring to a brief filed in the case that discussed an academic proposition called "mismatch theory."
"I'm just not impressed by the fact that the University of Texas may have fewer (African-Americans)," Scalia said, in part. "Maybe it ought to have fewer. And maybe some -- you know, when you take more, the number of blacks, really competent blacks, admitted to lesser schools, turns out to be less."
http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/10/politics/harry-reid-antonin-scalia-racist-comments/
其实他的观点对不对,数据有没有偏差都可以讨论,我最反感的是上来就扣一个racist大帽子,还能不能说话了啊?很多African American本来最适合的是职业学校, 这么说就是暗示他们不行吗?就是种族主义者吗?能不能来个open, healthy的debate,而不是乱扣帽子,言论阻塞就真正能帮助African American吗?
我深深的感到左派都是生活在云端的仙人,完全不了解人间的行情。。。我有个黑人trainer,他在Equinox和HRC上大课,除此以外还私下搞personal training,每小时80块,全cash不交税,这么下来收入挺好的,比那些大藤毕业在左派报刊上为AA摇旗呐喊的专栏作家挣得还多些! 他LP也是Equinox的trainer。两个人在Brooklyn买了很不错的房子,女儿7岁,已经显示了出众的运动能力,玩双截棍玩得很麻利。黑人里面,运动能力和音乐艺术很有天赋的人真的很多,干嘛非要念大学?八八的塞进去了,学习跟不上,不是打击人家的自信心吗?把真有心有能力念书的黑孩子招进大学里应该不是难事,除了在大学里用各种助学金奖学金帮助以外,还可以在高中设立专门的课外班和大学申请辅助,硬是把名额往黑孩子手里塞算个什么事呢?
说白了,左派表面上要多样性,其实骨子里是"万般皆下品 唯有读书高"的单一价值观;表面上要聆听各方面尤其是下层人士的声音,实际上动辄用racist这样的大帽子打压异己。
如果说照顾少数族裔是因为他们生活条件差,那按收入给低收入差学区的照顾不就行了吗?去除AA到底动了谁的奶酪?就是收入高家庭条件好的非裔西裔吧!这些人反而比家庭条件差的华人更容易进大学不是很不公平吗?
事实上,AA的确挤占的就是亚裔的名额,不然最近怎么会有几十个亚裔组织联名要求调查哈弗录取过程中的种族歧视问题?同样的学校,亚裔被录取需要的分数比黑人和莫莫要高一两百分。白人受到的影响相对较小。
Sometimes people are unqualified because they don't work hard enough. As we discussed, the solution should be concerned with public k-12, but not lowering the bar. The government could offer tutoring, better teaching resources to kids in need, but should not just have different admission standards based on ethnicity.
不考虑种族的校园,西部有 Caltech,东部有 CMU,你自己看看亚裔是多是少?历史上排华不假,历史上亚裔沾了黑人的光不假,不等于现在的情形仍然如此。AA下,亚裔的录取门槛是所有种族里最高的,你居然觉得是被AA照顾的结果?
这样的黑孩子,不需要AA一样能进好大学,不是吗?
你太无知了,伯克利本科没有AA,你知道新生中的亚裔比例吗?2015年老黑是2.8%,白人24.3%,光华裔就是19.5%,连越南裔都是3.2%
http://opa.berkeley.edu/uc-berkeley-fall-enrollment-data
那就在小学中学帮忙推一把啊!免费的辅导班,免费的大学申请辅助,专门给黑孩子,不就扯平了吗?给聪明好学的黑孩子提供被推的机会。
你说来说去,就是跟左媒一样空谈理想,跟现实脱钩得很。AA 的理想是帮助黑孩子里面聪明好学的那一群,可是现实是什么?同样的大学课堂,我面试的黑孩子,有会计系的解释不清LIFO FIFO的区别,有的上了 fixed income 讲不清 duration,这都是每门课最基本的概念,本科课程学不清楚也要怪父母没有推?都这样了,还好意思说自己的优点是学东西快,面试一问三不知还有脸写信问我究竟为啥不选他们,我倒是奇怪这样的孩子怎么混进藤校的呢!这叫聪明好学?是不是一路AA让他们觉得什么都不会也“应该”得到最好的机会?
我个人赞同按照家庭收入进行一定程度上的配比。比如,每个高中10% top学生优先录取。因为不同的区家庭收入水平不同,资源不均。给来自收入条件低的孩子足够的opportunity是合理的,只要他们优秀努力。而且也种做法也可以改善居住中segregation的状况,促进diversification。但是这优先录取以后剩下的名额就不应该再把宗族考虑其中了。至于是这个到底是10% 还是15% ,倒是可以研究商量,具体分析。
是呀。先要求入学按比例,以后大学生多了,再要求毕业按比例,再要求工作按比例。这些我们的毛主席都干过
亚裔在大学比例太高,肯定要有办法减低,不然你觉得政府怎么办?aa只不过让少数族裔得到关照。就算不照顾少数族裔,现在好大学亚裔这么多,你觉得美国其他种族一点没意见?只不过现在有其他少数族裔吸引了注意力,aa没了,看着吧,亚裔进好大学越来越来。ps,我一直觉得亚裔疯狂要进藤校是一种很畸形的价值观。华人上就有不少爬藤快爬疯了的家长。我觉得我自己作为亚裔也理解不了这种疯狂,别说其他族裔了
这不是在哪个大学已经吵吵起来了吗?要求大学staff 里面黑人比例要跟总人口中的比例一致。。。AA进来的大学生找不到好工作,迟早会在职场上要求AA,不然怎么消化AA毕业生?
亚裔爬藤就是原罪,黑人爬藤就不是了,是这个意思吗?再说一遍,AA取消以后亚裔读书更难,是你脱离现实的假想。现在那些不考虑种族的大学里,亚裔比例更高而不是更低。最后,别以为白人不爬藤,他们推娃的力度一点不比亚裔小,从 pre-K 就开始了,娃一出生就赶紧排队去了。
当然我支持给低收入家庭的孩子适当的照顾,但不支持按肤色来照顾
父母花时间精力投入到孩子的教育中,知道孩子资质一般所以要求孩子更努力的学习来上好的大学受更好的教育,怎么就不公平了?
另外,宁愿让我们掏腰包改善他们的基础教育甚至是课外补习。也不希望AA。
美国现在很大一个问题就是某些种族有莫名其妙的 entitlement, 动不动就甩R word。。。题外话:这两年DC 地产发展很快,不少黑人社区的烂房子被推倒重建,然后白人买了房子搬进来。前一阵就有个黑人在自家门前树了个牌子,叫白人滚出自己的社区。这事被宣传成黑人保卫自己的传统社区。要是换成白人树个牌子叫黑人滚。。。呵呵!双标得厉害。
人家推你也可以推呀,你自己不愿意推人家推就是造成社会不公了?
政府应该严打犯罪,严抓毒贩子,很多孩子被坏人和毒品带坏了。不能培养他们victim的心态,而是鼓励家长和孩子每个人都要自己负责。除了中小学教育资源改善,也要发展更多的职业教育,大学不适于每个人,强扭的瓜不甜。
He said, according to audio released on Friday, "there are those who contend that it does not benefit African-Americans to get them into the University of Texas where they do not do well, as opposed to having them go to a less-advanced school, a less -- a slower-track school, where they do well."
He also added "one of the briefs pointed out that most of the black scientists in this country don't come from schools like the University of Texas."
Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid denounced Scalia's comments as "racist" on Thursday, and longtime civil rights leader Rep. John Lewis of Georgia questioned whether he could remain impartial in the case currently before the court.
民主党这次形式不利,又拿出了racist大棒妄图干预。。。
赞成。有权利受教育,不等于一定能受大学教育,更不等于一定能去好的大学,后者需要有资格,也就是 merit based。同样的,我们都有权利打篮球,但是不等于一定能参加职业篮球队,更不等于一定能去打 NBA,因为后者也是 merit based。律师小妹妹在偷换概念呢。
AA 在美国现在争议很大,美其名曰照顾 minority 考虑 diversity, 实际上只照顾某一个特定肤色,亚裔同样是 minority 却深受打击。当初建立AA的时候,黑人不能跟白人上一样的学校,过一样的生活,AA有它的现实意义。可是几十年过去了,早已时过境迁,AA已经成为实际上的种族歧视。
有兴趣的,可以狗一下 University of Michigan law school reverse discrimination. 这个 case里,Supreme court 明确表示种族不可以在录取过程中影响太大, 支持密歇根州禁止大学用种族作为录取标准,并直接判定 racial quota违宪。
http://fox17online.com/2014/04/22/u-s-supreme-court-upholds-michigan-ban-on-affirmative-action/
那位根本不要孩子,这话题跟她一毛钱关系没有,纯秀智商来的
affirmative action
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirmative_action
The term "affirmative action" was first used in the United States in "Executive Order No.10925",[6] signed by President John F. Kennedy on 6 March 1961, which included a provision that government contractors "take affirmative action to ensure that applicants are employed, and employees are treated during employment, without regard to their race, creed, color, or national origin."[7] In 1967, gender was added to the anti-discrimination list.
不过现在AA已经成为了 reverse discrimination 的 代名词 ,尤其是大学录取过程中,专门用来偏袒黑人,打压白人和亚裔,早已违背了 without regard to race, color 的初衷。
大家有不同意见可以好好说话,不要人身攻击,不然就沦为攀比谁比谁更 low 了,没意思。
美国是 common law, 也就是法律的制定和实施都不可以违背 common sense, 要具体事件具体分析,比较灵活和易于调整。不管 AA 初衷如何,如果它的具体实施违背了初衷和宪法,带来新的歧视,给社会带来新的不公平,那么它的废除只是时间问题。同样是 common law 的英国就不搞 AA,只搞 positive action, 也就是给弱势群体提供 equal opportunity 但是不降低对他们的要求,跟我们楼上很多人的观点一致,值得借鉴。奴隶制废除了,种族隔离废除了,随着越来越多的anti reverse discrimination 案件引起关注,我对在有生之年看到 AA 的废除持乐观态度。
没有多少亚裔
要搞AA怎么那些圈就不搞?
难道非要学某种族,只管生不管养,才算正常吗??
真正优秀的人出现了!支持!