分析:许多麦麸 (面筋,gluten)不耐受的美国人到了欧洲吃小麦制品平安无事 - dudaan

吃与活
楼主 (文学城)
杜编提出的这个现象很有意思,我记得有网友在此也说过亲身经历。

美国的小麦和欧洲的小麦本身似乎没有很大的区别,那么在生产和加工环节可能是有区别的。杜编给出的链接中有个评论,提到美国烤面包时用溴酸钾,而欧洲不用。其评论原文如下:

 

Melodykanis 3/4/2019 8:37:23 AM

I would suggest this. Is it gluten intolerance, or are we adding an ingredient in the United States that is causing our digestive issues? My problem started 1 year ago. I feel very fortunate to have found that it isn't actually the gluten. It is the carcinogen "bromate". When I eat any wheat product that does not have bromate in it, I have no reaction. This carcinogen is not allowed in many countries including China???? The problem is that it is not required as a listed ingredient. Some of the places that I have found that do not use flour with bromate are Great Harvest Bread, and Panera Bread. I would suggest trying this. Then research, research, research. I buy pasta made in Italy, and make my own bakery items as much as possible. King Arthur flour is one of the brands that is not processed with Bromate. This epidemic is actually a poisoning. Is there any way to stop this???

 

wiki,得知:

溴酸钾是一个无机盐,室温下为无色晶体,分子式为KBrO3。

其在发酵、醒发及焙烤工艺过程中起到一种氧化剂的作用,使用了溴酸钾后的面粉更白,制作的面包能快速膨胀,更具有弹性和韧性,在焙烤业被认为是最好的面粉改良剂之一。溴酸钾有致癌性,现在已被許多國家(如欧盟)禁用,但在美国仍允许使用。溴酸钾在足够长的烘烤时间和温度下会耗尽,但是如果在面粉中添加的太多就会有残留。

中华人民共和国卫生部于2005年5月30日发布《2005年第9号公告》称,根据溴酸钾危险性评估结果,决定自2005年7月1日起,取消溴酸钾作为面粉处理剂在小麦粉中使用。在此之前按照《食品添加剂使用卫生标准》(GB2760-1996)使用溴酸钾的食品可以在产品保质期内继续销售。

 

对麦麸不耐受的主要机制是麦麸中的麦醇溶蛋白被消化分解产生的多肽进入体内引起过敏反应在烘焙过程中,麦醇溶蛋白与麦麸中的谷蛋白通过二硫键形成胶联产物,而溴酸钾是氧化剂,减少了该反应的发生。虽然机理还不很清楚,我们也许可以这样假设:

在烘焙过程中,容易产生过敏反应原的麦醇溶蛋白与谷蛋白形成胶联产物,这使麦醇溶蛋白被消化分解成过敏原的机会降低。由于溴酸钾的存在,这种胶联反应受到阻碍,从而麦醇溶蛋白被分解成致敏多肽的机会增加,导致食用者产生麦麸不耐受反应。

溴酸钾有致癌的可能,除美国外世界上的主要国家(中国,欧盟等)都禁用溴酸钾作为膨发剂。这可能是杜编观察到“许多麦麸不耐受的美国人到了欧洲吃小麦制品平安无事”的原因。

纯属臆测,供讨论,非结论。

 对于想进一步了解面包中的溴酸钾的朋友,可参考:

Another Reason to Eat Organic – No Potassium Bromate in Your Bread

  主要参考文章:

https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/jf070639n

J Agric Food Chem. 2007 Jun 27;55(13):5320-5. Epub 2007 May 31. Impact of redox agents on the extractability of gluten proteins during bread making. Lagrain B1, Thewissen BG, Brijs K, Delcour JA. Abstract

The gluten proteins gliadin and glutenin are important for dough and bread characteristics. In the present work, redox agents were used to impact gluten properties and to study gliadin-glutenin interactions in bread making. In control bread making, mixing increased the extractability of glutenin. The level of SDS-extractable glutenin decreased during fermentation and then further in the oven. The levels of extractable alpha- and gamma-gliadin also decreased during bread baking due to gliadin-glutenin polymerization. Neither oxidizing nor reducing agents had an impact on glutenin extractabilities after mixing. The redox additives did not affect omega-gliadin extractabilities during bread making due to their lack of cysteine residues. Potassium iodate (0.82-2.47 micromol/g of protein) and potassium bromate (1.07-3.17 micromol/g of protein) increased both alpha- and gamma-gliadin extractabilities during baking. Increasing concentrations of glutathione (1.15-3.45 micromol/g of protein) decreased levels of extractable alpha- and gamma-gliadins during baking. The work not only demonstrated that, during baking, glutenin and gliadin polymerize through heat-induced sulfhydryl-disulfide exchange reactions, but also demonstrated for the first time that oxidizing agents, besides their effect on dough rheology and hence bread volume, hinder gliadin-glutenin linking during baking, while glutathione increases the degree of covalent gliadin to glutenin linking.


  https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6617089/

Wheat proteins have been associated with a number of dietary disorders. The best well-known disorder is celiac disease, a disorder that develops in genetically susceptible individuals after ingesting gluten-containing cereals. Wheat gliadins, and to a lesser extent low molecular weight glutenins, carry immunogenic peptides [81]. A variety of these celiac-disease-initiating peptides of α-gliadin have been identified. Examples of some of these immunogenic epitopes are glia-α9 (PFPQPQLPY) and glia-α20 (FRPQQPUPQ) [82]. The unusual amino acid composition (high proline and glutamine contents) in gluten proteins prevents the complete digestion of these proteins in the gastrointestinal tract. While for most people the peptides do not cause any problems, an estimated 1% of the world population suffers from celiac disease [83] and in these individuals, these peptides trigger a cascade of auto-immune reactions that lead to severe intestinal damage. Several researchers have been trying to develop solutions for people suffering from celiac disease. One of these investigated solutions involves the pretreatment of the gluten protein with peptidase mixtures (e.g., papaya non-specific endopeptidase and three microbial peptidases (Aspergillus oryzae leucine aminopeptidase, Aspergillus melleus endopeptidase with activity against hydrophibic amino acid residues and Penicillium citrinum deutorlysin)) [84]. These peptidases are able to digest the above proline-rich peptides and, hence lower the concentration of the immunogenic peptides. Other strategies include the development of wheat varieties that do not trigger these gastrointestinal responses [81] and targeted processing of the cereals. One of such novel cereals is tritordeum, a hybrid of durum wheat and wild barley [85]. Tritordeum was shown to have lower numbers of immunogenic epitopes than regular wheat. This novel cereal is suitable to include in diets for people that want to reduce their gluten intake, but not for people suffering from celiac disease as there are still gluten immunogenic peptides produced upon digestion [85]. Processing has a big effect on the physicochemical properties of gluten, and will, hence, affect the digestive stability, and, hence, the antigenic potential of the protein [86]. Rahaman and colleagues [86] found that shear by itself does not affect protein digestibility, while pH and temperature substantially affect gluten digestibility and the antigenic characteristics of the hydrolysates that are formed. At pH 3, gluten undergoes acidic deamidation that will lead to a better hydrolysis of the proteins, generating smaller peptide fractions with a lower antigenicity [86,87]. When heating proteins, proteins are aggregating, increasing the resistance of the proteins against digestion [86]

 

https://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E6%BA%B4%E9%85%B8%E9%92%BE

溴酸钾[编辑]

维基百科,自由的百科全书     溴酸钾 识别 性质 结构 热力学 危险性
IUPAC名
Potassium bromate
别名 Potassium bromate(V)
Bromic acid, potassium salt
CAS号 7758-01-2  
PubChem 23673461
ChemSpider 22852
SMILES  显示▼
InChI  显示▼
InChIKey OCATYIAKPYKMPG-REWHXWOFAM
UN编号 1484
EINECS 231-829-8
ChEBI 38211
RTECS EF8725000
KEGG C19295
化学式 KBrO3
摩尔质量 167.00 g/mol g·mol?¹
外观 白色結晶粉末
密度 3.27 g/cm3
熔点 350 °C(623 K)
沸点 370 °C(643 K)
溶解性 3.1 g/100 mL (0 °C)
6.91 g/100 mL (20 °C)
13.3 g/100 mL (40 °C)
49.7 g/100 mL (100 °C)
溶解性 微溶於乙醇
不溶於丙酮
晶体结构 六邊形
ΔfHmo298K -342.5 kJ/mol
警示术语 R:R45 R9 R25
安全术语 S:S53 S45
欧盟分类 Carc. Cat. 2
Toxic (T)
Oxidant (O)
NFPA 704 0 2 2  
闪点 Non-flammable
致死量或浓度:
LD50(中位剂量 157 mg/kg (oral, rat)[1]
若非注明,所有数据均出自一般条件(25 ℃,100 kPa)下。

溴酸钾是一个无机盐,室温下为无色晶体,分子式为KBrO3。

其在发酵、醒发及焙烤工艺过程中起到一种氧化剂的作用,使用了溴酸钾后的面粉更白,制作的面包能快速膨胀,更具有弹性和韧性,在焙烤业被认为是最好的面粉改良剂之一。溴酸钾有致癌性,现在已被許多國家(如欧盟)禁用,但在美国仍允许使用。溴酸钾在足够长的烘烤时间和温度下会耗尽,但是如果在面粉中添加的太多就会有残留。

中华人民共和国卫生部于2005年5月30日发布《2005年第9号公告》称,根据溴酸钾危险性评估结果,决定自2005年7月1日起,取消溴酸钾作为面粉处理剂在小麦粉中使用。在此之前按照《食品添加剂使用卫生标准》(GB2760-1996)使用溴酸钾的食品可以在产品保质期内继续销售。

d
dudaan
很有道理!

不知道有没有不耐受的朋友试吃欧洲进口的cookies来验证一下。

米兰之夜
链接里边的都是焙烤食品

链接里边的bread, croissants, thin-crust pizza, layer cake and giant pretzels都是烘烤食物。

也许需要排除一下,麦麸不耐受的美国人到欧洲吃一下不烤的面食,如面条,看怎么样。如果结果相同,则可排除溴酸钾。

无论如何,这都是个很有意思的话题。

米兰之夜
还应当有个事实

美国人在美国吃在欧洲出品的面包,怎样?应当和美国面包没有区别。以当今的国际贸易之发达,美国人在美国吃在欧洲出品的面包应当是家常便饭,至少我还没听说,在美国吃欧洲产的面包,对麦麸不耐受有何不同。

按传统的、认为面筋是麦麸不耐受元凶看法,我这个脑洞开的略大一点。

两小千金妈妈
请问这是做很多中式点心说用的臭粉吗?
l
longnv
我就对麦麸质过敏,到中国也不敢吃面食点心
米兰之夜
不是,那是碳酸氢铵
v
viewfinder
如果是这个原因,吃有机的面粉制品应该就可以。另外美国卖的大部分通心粉都是意大利进口的。
吃与活
面筋和麦麸是两回事吗?
吃与活
不是。
吃与活
我估计那些在欧洲吃就没事的朋友是轻度患者。美国欧洲的面包过敏原都在,但在量上应该有区别。对麦麸不过敏的朋友可以吃这个试试

吃与活
应该推荐给洞主享用 :)
吃与活
你可能要用gluten free的食物
吃与活
才看到也有加了溴酸钾的面粉,这种面粉也不中
刁小山
我最近煮粥除了大米,放一把小麦,一把大麦(大小麦都连皮的),是不是麦麸过敏的人不能吃?

我自己没有任何问题

虎嗅蔷薇
很久以前我看到文章说溴酸钾干扰甲状腺功能,之后就一直买不加有这个添加物的面粉。King Arthur这个牌子的面粉不用漂白剂,不
虎嗅蔷薇
不加溴酸钾。每个超市都买得到。
l
longnv
我就是吃Gluten free食品,我外甥在中国也是gluten 过敏
l
longnv
这个信息很好,我就是到美国有轻度甲减的
米兰之夜
才发现,我错了

错把麦麸做夫子 

更正:麸质 = 面筋 = 麦胶 = 谷蛋白 ≠ 麦麸

链接

兰竹
现在食品的添加剂太普遍,要尽量避免!

溴酸钾是一个无机盐,室温下为无色晶体,分子式为KBrO3。

其在发酵、醒发及焙烤工艺过程中起到一种氧化剂的作用,使用了溴酸钾后的面粉更白,制作的面包能快速膨胀,更具有弹性和韧性,在焙烤业被认为是最好的面粉改良剂之一。溴酸钾有致癌性,现在已被許多國家(如欧盟)禁用,但在美国仍允许使用。溴酸钾在足够长的烘烤时间和温度下会耗尽,但是如果在面粉中添加的太多就会有残留。

v
viewfinder
哈哈,这面粉挺诚实,赫然写着Bromated
d
dudaan
我查了家里的两袋面粉,都没有直接标溴酸钾

一袋是超市自己牌子的普通面粉,Ingredients 只写了 bleached flour。我的理解是,bleached 不一定就是用来溴酸钾。到底有没有不知道。

另一袋是超市牌子的未漂白面粉,Ingredients 写了加有 enzyme , 什么酶?不知道。

据说在加州出售的面粉加了溴酸钾必须带有警告标识,羡慕。

 

米兰之夜
弟兄们,我觉得我们应当澄清一个概念

我们现在讨论的应当是麸质(gluten)过敏,而非麦麸过敏。

麦麸就是那层麦壳,还没有听说对那玩意过敏的。

麸质 = 面筋 = 麦胶 = 谷蛋白 ≠ 麦麸

——麦麸是外面的麸皮,麸质是里面的蛋白质

——把小麦粉用水清洗,洗掉淀粉后剩下的就是麸质

参考

d
dudaan
翻译的问题,以前讨论过,的确翻译得不好
米兰之夜


吃教授问我的时候,把我问一愣

米兰之夜
上面澄清了,和麸皮无关
d
dudaan
南方人(上海人?)把面筋叫麸,例如烤麸
d
dudaan
而字典里麸的解释只有麦子磨碎筛后剩下的外皮的意思
l
lawattaction
所以,尽量不要买加工产品:面包,各类点心,罐装的食物,少下饭店。比如图中的太好吃了

Costco 免费品尝的,犹豫再三,没买。就是考虑到它们是加工产品,不知道放的什么添加剂,让它们那么好吃!!!都走不动道了!!!

 

l
lawattaction


吃与活
我修改了一下,用面筋代替麦麸。
l
lawattaction
bleached 面粉,我不买。我吃的这袋也没说是否加了溴酸钾。 今天注意到了 iron 10%。

虎嗅蔷薇
加拿大产的面粉不准加溴酸钾,没有加
虎嗅蔷薇
也许是加了淀粉酶。你看下面加拿大的面粉里有加 amylase。
l
lawattaction
大赞!这样就清楚多了!带麦麸(皮)算粗粮,营养成分高,好东西。
闲情
记得我小时候。。。很久很久以前,很穷的小镇上,和邻居孩子们一起玩洗面筋做泡泡糖
吃与活
很穷,洗面筋

那么浪费粮食,哪里穷了?

闲情
穷孩子没得玩,背着父母玩一回,记忆一生呢。
吃与活
对孩子来说玩比吃重要

大人一般不这么看

l
lawattaction
那就好!这袋面的缺点就是20kg,没有10kg包装。
l
lawattaction
这袋面的优点:面筋少,烙葱油饼,擀的时候容易;面筋多的,一边往外擀,一边往回抽筋,擀不开,擀不大。
T
TBz
以前,馒头是主食,每顿吃四两,那时候没听说有人吃了馒头不适的。
l
lawattaction
现在,糖尿病人只能吃半片到一片全麦面包。我当时就想,就不能不吃?一点不吃?
t
thetruth111
美国有不少人说,美国现在的小麦很糟糕。都是70年代时的

转基因的小麦。那时的转基因技术刚刚开始,所以转出来的小麦吃了容易发胖,并且Gluten 蛋白质吃了也容易过敏。

下面这篇是个例子

https://davidduke.com/how-wheat-has-been-modified-and-why-you-should-avoid-it/

How Wheat has been Modified and Why You Should Avoid it
l
lawattaction
很可能1960 年就转基因了

 

 

The change in the genetics of wheet since 1960,such as that of high-yielding dwarf strains, could conceivably account for the recent increased incidence of type 1 diabetes. It's appearance coincides with the increase in celiac disease and other diseases.

《wheat belly》William Davis,MD