继续等高人。。。。another interesting thing about this book is like watching one of life's fallacies at work: make up one's mind, draw a conclusion, then look for evidence to support it. When something doesn't support this conclusion? hey, what the heck, I didn't see it, or it's a lie! [此贴子已经被作者于2010/2/23 11:34:59编辑过]
Have no time to read, but am curious. What's your opinion?
i actually dont' know what beijingers are like....kongkong has the typical 既得利益阶层 in my mind, i.e. 肉糜。。。。。。至于为什么我把肉糜跟北京等同起来，我自己也满奇怪的。我根本也不认识几个北京孩子是这样的，而且我也没在北京读书过。
Have no time to read, but am curious. What's your opinion?
instinctively i feel "fallacy at work" but i dont have the brain/logic to point out exactly where she went amiss. need someone to point this out to me.....sigh
i actually dont' know what beijingers are like....kongkong has the typical 既得利益阶层 in my mind, i.e. 肉糜。。。。。。至于为什么我把肉糜跟北京等同起来，我自己也满奇怪的。我根本也不认识几个北京孩子是这样的，而且我也没在北京读书过。 。。。。。。。。。。。。。。。。
i actually dont' know what beijingers are like....kongkong has the typical 既得利益阶层 in my mind, i.e. 肉糜。。。。。。至于为什么我把肉糜跟北京等同起来，我自己也满奇怪的。我根本也不认识几个北京孩子是这样的，而且我也没在北京读书过。
Is Kongkong from Kuangdong? :P She has the 'free-mind' spirit which I don't always see in Beijingers...
i actually dont' know what beijingers are like....kongkong has the typical 既得利益阶层 in my mind, i.e. 肉糜。。。。。。至于为什么我把肉糜跟北京等同起来，我自己也满奇怪的。我根本也不认识几个北京孩子是这样的，而且我也没在北京读书过。 肉糜是啥引申含义，
instinctively i feel "fallacy at work" but i dont have the brain/logic to point out exactly where she went amiss. need someone to point this out to me.....sigh
谁要的。。。跟我dropbox连起来。。。。。。我听的肚子里一团气郁结了。比如她攻击walmart给工人条件很差，牺牲工人的一切来赢得利润。论据之一是，walmart 卖东西的人买不起walmart卖的东西。我马上就想，难道neman marcus /nordstorm (how to spell this?!) 的售货员一定买的起自己买的东西？豪华家具店呢？电子产品店呢？这个叫什么论据啊。另外说walmart报告说效率提高了，她说walmart is known to doctor its records anyway，意思是，通过谎报员工的工作时间来实现的。好么，人家报告里的数据，自己想用的就拿来用，自己不喜欢的就说是人家捏造的。。。。
另外她攻击在第三世界国家使用童工，和攻击维护童工制度的人。结果她说：你知道这些维护童工制度的人说不让儿童工作他们会怎样么？他们会闲着做坏事。。。。。。。。。。come on，我怎么觉得大家是说，这些儿童如果不工作就连现在的生活水平都达不到呢。。。。。。感觉这个作者pick and choose了一些明显flawed论点来攻击，轻易攻破后觉得这样就证明自己论点了。。。。。。。
i really think it has nothing to do with so called "优越的背景", i am from a common family background. just my parents and my teachers never restricted me in any way shape of form. and i feel " 既得利益阶层 " very disturbing. I would like to ask you politely not to use that phrase on me. Every single step, i took conciously on my own, and i am one of the hardest working type of people i know of. I respect you worked very hard to get what you have today, but please also know that i come to who i am today with hard work as well. there is nobody really provided back doors to me, or give me special treatment, because i did not need them.
谁要的。。。跟我dropbox连起来。。。。。。我听的肚子里一团气郁结了。比如她攻击walmart给工人条件很差，牺牲工人的一切来赢得利润。论据之一是，walmart 卖东西的人买不起walmart卖的东西。我马上就想，难道neman marcus /nordstorm (how to spell this?!) 的售货员一定买的起自己买的东西？豪华家具店呢？电子产品店呢？这个叫什么论据啊。另外说walmart报告说效率提高了，她说walmart is known to doctor its records anyway，意思是，通过谎报员工的工作时间来实现的。好么，人家报告里的数据，自己想用的就拿来用，自己不喜欢的就说是人家捏造的。。。。
谁要的。。。跟我dropbox连起来。。。。。。我听的肚子里一团气郁结了。比如她攻击walmart给工人条件很差，牺牲工人的一切来赢得利润。论据之一是，walmart 卖东西的人买不起walmart卖的东西。我马上就想，难道neman marcus /nordstorm (how to spell this?!) 的售货员一定买的起自己买的东西？豪华家具店呢？电子产品店呢？这个叫什么论据啊。另外说walmart报告说效率提高了，她说walmart is known to doctor its records anyway，意思是，通过谎报员工的工作时间来实现的。好么，人家报告里的数据，自己想用的就拿来用，自己不喜欢的就说是人家捏造的。。。。
Acturally, from what u descirbed in the previous 2 posts about her, I have this feeling that she's just one of those idealists--rush to the ideal conclusion without much scientific proof and sound reserach--typical democrats... :P
i really think it has nothing to do with so called "优越的背景", i am from a common family background. just my parents and my teachers never restricted me in any way shape of form. and i feel " 既得利益阶层 " very disturbing. I would like to ask you politely not to use that phrase on me. Every single step, i took conciously on my own, and i am one of the hardest working type of people i know of. I respect you worked very hard to get what you have today, but please also know that i come to who i am today with hard work as well. there is nobody really provided back doors to me, or give me special treatment, because i did not need them.
i really think it has nothing to do with so called "优越的背景", i am from a common family background. just my parents and my teachers never restricted me in any way shape of form. and i feel " 既得利益阶层 " very disturbing. I would like to ask you politely not to use that phrase on me. Every single step, i took conciously on my own, and i am one of the hardest working type of people i know of. I respect you worked very hard to get what you have today, but please also know that i come to who i am today with hard work as well. there is nobody really provided back doors to me, or give me special treatment, because i did not need them.
Kongkong, I have to say, it's very starnge to me that all your teachers did not restrict you in any form. One is fine, but hard to understand none of them did. :P
Acturally, from what u descirbed in the previous 2 posts about her, I have this feeling that she's just one of those idealists--rush to the ideal conclusion without much scientific proof and sound reserach--typical democrats... :P
这个作者，很另人佩服的亲身参与了她写作的research。比如她写nickel and dime就亲身成为挣minimum wage的一员这样去过了好几个月。她写bait and switch的时候也作为白领失业者一员去试图找了几个月工作。前者我没看，不知道。bait and switch我看了，不过她找工作的approach跟我预想的有很大的差距。读了之后禁不住要想，世界到底要如何？大家全都不同工但是要同筹么？
"this land is their land"还有一个例子说genentech给员工巨好的福利。但是他们的onsite subsidized cafeteria, which is subcontracted via this kind of firms, of course, offers extremely poor working conditions and benefits to its employees. then there's fight, media exposure etc between the cafeteria employees and the employers. 然后作者非常义愤填膺genentech居然对此不做什么表示。COME ON，这样的情况要genentech怎么表示吧？切断跟食物供应公司的合同，自己开一个食物供应公司，并且给这个cafeteria worker全部加scientist的头衔和待遇？
这个作者，很另人佩服的亲身参与了她写作的research。比如她写nickel and dime就亲身成为挣minimum wage的一员这样去过了好几个月。她写bait and switch的时候也作为白领失业者一员去试图找了几个月工作。前者我没看，不知道。bait and switch我看了，不过她找工作的approach跟我预想的有很大的差距。读了之后禁不住要想，世界到底要如何？大家全都不同工但是要同筹么？
Experience does not mean research. What she sees may not be the whole truth. That's why I feel she huaren.us into her conclusion. And, I'm always again this type of ideal socialism. History proved it didn't work.
Kongkong, I have to say, it's very starnge to me that all your teachers did not restrict you in any form. One is fine, but hard to understand none of them did. :P
what can i say, i am lucky. (actually in elementary school my last few years not so, but it did not affect me much for some reason).. all my other major teachers (ban zhu ren) really allow me thrive, my middle school both are math teachers, so i guess we hit it off..... so i am thankful today...
"this land is their land"还有一个例子说genentech给员工巨好的福利。但是他们的onsite subsidized cafeteria, which is subcontracted via this kind of firms, of course, offers extremely poor working conditions and benefits to its employees. then there's fight, media exposure etc between the cafeteria employees and the employers. 然后作者非常义愤填膺genentech居然对此不做什么表示。COME ON，这样的情况要genentech怎么表示吧？切断跟食物供应公司的合同，自己开一个食物供应公司，并且给这个cafeteria worker全部加scientist的头衔和待遇？
what can i say, i am lucky. (actually in elementary school my last few years not so, but it did not affect me much for some reason).. all my other major teachers (ban zhu ren) really allow me thrive, my middle school both are math teachers, so i guess we hit it off..... so i am thankful today...
See, I'm curious about that 'some reason'. I guess it was really your dad's attitude helped a lot. So you didn't really care about those who tried to shape you.
Experience does not mean research. What she sees may not be the whole truth. That's why I feel she huaren.us into her conclusion. And, I'm always again this type of ideal socialism. History proved it didn't work.
i agree. to look for a job with a researching mind is completely different experience. it is just like paper stock transaction. it means nothing
"this land is their land"还有一个例子说genentech给员工巨好的福利。但是他们的onsite subsidized cafeteria, which is subcontracted via this kind of firms, of course, offers extremely poor working conditions and benefits to its employees. then there's fight, media exposure etc between the cafeteria employees and the employers. 然后作者非常义愤填膺genentech居然对此不做什么表示。COME ON，这样的情况要genentech怎么表示吧？切断跟食物供应公司的合同，自己开一个食物供应公司，并且给这个cafeteria worker全部加scientist的头衔和待遇？
If there's a problem within the company, the company is responsible to solve the problem. Anyway, it's just a common issue of management.
although i'd like to you, my dignity tells me you are pitying me now i feel stuck since I am not able to find an english word to express my complex feeling
Genentech contract the cafe to the food supplier, who is considered the representative of the real customers (workers). If the service was terrible, the representative is responsible to speak for the customers and revise the contract.
我超级需要知道，世界到底应该如何work.......穷人很穷，是很可怜啊，但是怎么解决呢？从CEO身上挂油下来分给领foodstamps的人，给他们饭吃，给他们衣服穿，给他们universal health care?
My, you're considering this BIG question. So far, there's no genius ever come up with a single solution. :) I believe the world works by itself, bit by bit improving... The poor needs to work out the solution for themselves, just like we immigrants need to find our way out. So far education seems the best way to help.
Genentech contract the cafe to the food supplier, who is considered the representative of the real customers (workers). If the service was terrible, the representative is responsible to speak for the customers and revise the contract.
没看懂“if service is terrible"是什么意思，genentech接受的服务是很好的。作者意思是dish out food的工人工作条件比较差。这样的情况下genentech的责任是什么呢？
My, you're considering this BIG question. So far, there's no genius ever come up with a single solution. :) I believe the world works by itself, bit by bit improving... The poor needs to work out the solution for themselves, just like we immigrants need to find our way out. So far education seems the best way to help.
教育也被作者攻击了哈哈。说大学学费是so so 贵啊，学出来也找不到工作啊。。。。。。。。这个在中国还真是的呢。美国不知道。这个要怎么解决？
今天。。。。。。。罗嗦上了哈。"bait and switch" 上次我好像也说过。讲作者隐姓埋名，假装是一个独立工作很久，想找corporate里面固定工作的人。她要找做PR的工作，在各种career coach, networking event和seminar上浪费了大量金钱后，９个月都没有找到一份工作，最后放弃了。这些人的displacement的确是个社会问题，这些人年纪不老小，又没啥特殊skill，当世界as a whole need your skillset的时候就有工作，世界不需要那么多成天出来磨嘴皮子的人的时候，这些白领就没工作呗。还要怎样吧。。。。。真的只有blame社会这一条路？
没看懂“if service is terrible"是什么意思，genentech接受的服务是很好的。作者意思是dish out food的工人工作条件比较差。这样的情况下genentech的责任是什么呢？
Hehe, I thought the cafe was terrible--which happens in where I'm now... Now I see that the author's point. I guess it's like protesting products made by children--not so extreme though. ;P
今天。。。。。。。罗嗦上了哈。"bait and switch" 上次我好像也说过。讲作者隐姓埋名，假装是一个独立工作很久，想找corporate里面固定工作的人。她要找做PR的工作，在各种career coach, networking event和seminar上浪费了大量金钱后，９个月都没有找到一份工作，最后放弃了。这些人的displacement的确是个社会问题，这些人年纪不老小，又没啥特殊skill，当世界as a whole need your skillset的时候就有工作，世界不需要那么多成天出来磨嘴皮子的人的时候，这些白领就没工作呗。还要怎样吧。。。。。真的只有blame社会这一条路？
She can be a lobbyist to ask for government intervention to support people like her... :P
She can be a lobbyist to ask for government intervention to support people like her... :P
sigh 她也说了应该去hire lobbist 为umemployed白领争取福利。关键，关键，我脑海里面对社会应当如何这个问题没有确切的答案，blame the poor for being poor 就是典型肉糜思想了－－我承认在这个问题上我还是很肉糜的，我就是不明白这些人的entitlement 感觉是哪里来的，为什么认为the world owns them a living no matter what。。。。。。。。
sigh 她也说了应该去hire lobbist 为umemployed白领争取福利。关键，关键，我脑海里面对社会应当如何这个问题没有确切的答案，blame the poor for being poor 就是典型肉糜思想了－－我承认在这个问题上我还是很肉糜的，我就是不明白这些人的entitlement 感觉是哪里来的，为什么认为the world owns them a living no matter what。。。。。。。。
Is it funny that from a socialism country, most of us get this idea--blame the poor for being poor; while in the richest capitalism country, the poor gets their entitlement. :) See, that's why I feel education is important. :P
We have different self-history and different interests. There's never a single answer to all.
Hehe, I feel you are always looking for some standard answer. Like how you don't understand enen's words because of your more strict rules on grammar. :)
昨天看她的帖子了，一直追到20也左右。我也想看她说理财，尤其是flip house挣的钱怎么都让她给抵消了，老妖jj也问她了，可是她就开始打太极拳，还说要consulting费用。
且，如果要收钱的话就不要拿到论坛上来讲了，本来这里都是自愿给大家信息的。
修整房子的费用信息很有用，可是不喜欢她总是说她能拿到很低的价钱，别人吗，想要这个价就得让她飞去亲自还价了。至少你把你拿到的价钱告诉大家，好让大家有个比较，天底下就她一个会讲价钱的啦？
this woman certainly has brain. she knows very well how to jinyin her life. this is something i really think positively of her.
she certainly also need attention, and she needs to show she is superb..
我知道，光头是我，但是搜不到
xiaoguangtouwo
记得听书听到过，家里有枪的危险小于有游泳池的危险
我家准备去买枪。。。。
this woman certainly has brain. she knows very well how to jinyin her life. this is something i really think positively of her.
she certainly also need attention, and she needs to show she is superb..
空空居然不是北京的？南方口音满重嘛
空空居然不是北京的？南方口音满重嘛
昨天看她的帖子了，一直追到20也左右。我也想看她说理财，尤其是flip house挣的钱怎么都让她给抵消了，老妖jj也问她了，可是她就开始打太极拳，还说要consulting费用。
且，如果要收钱的话就不要拿到论坛上来讲了，本来这里都是自愿给大家信息的。
修整房子的费用信息很有用，可是不喜欢她总是说她能拿到很低的价钱，别人吗，想要这个价就得让她飞去亲自还价了。至少你把你拿到的价钱告诉大家，好让大家有个比较，天底下就她一个会讲价钱的啦？
不实在，可能自己经营得很好，但是很难让别人think highly
最近正在背单词ing.....
今天晚饭昨天就做好了。
响油大虾芦笋
卤牛筋
青菜炒蘑菇
蕃茄蛋汤
口水～～
空空居然不是北京的？南方口音满重嘛
哈哈哈。
好奇一下，空空的好多想法是不是特符合你心目中的北京人？
我上班单程0.8 mile, door-to-door 走了28分钟。
今天就穿厚底人字拖来的，皮鞋装包里。
我打算以后把上班常穿的两三双高跟鞋放办公室里，然后就球鞋人字拖换着穿。
加油
[此贴子已经被作者于2010/2/23 12:29:20编辑过]
空空居然不是北京的？南方口音满重嘛
hoho
空空居然不是北京的？南方口音满重嘛
我怎么觉得她就是南方人？
http://tieku.org/254651/1.html
哎呀，谢谢谢谢
谢谢空空，晚上回家弄。这个记人名是我最头疼的，我同事家10个孩子，我只能记住一半，哈哈。更别提狗狗的名字了。我主要是想提高英语，大家有没有推荐的？
好多人都推荐看电视，跟着电视念
好多人都推荐看电视，跟着电视念
我觉得说出来很重要，光听不说，很难全听懂，然后更难说出来。要是能一边听，一边说，跟着说也好，聊天也好，进步就特别快。
我有两个经验，一个是闺女小的时候看finding nemo，我们天天看，当背景声音，我基本上那部电影，半年里听了200遍，然后都能背下来了，再看其他动画片，就觉得特容易，
一个是，我在一个教堂的英语学校上课，每次就是聊天，什么都说，慢慢的，听说都提高了，而且不象应试学习考过就忘，这种方法，提高了以后就是自己的了。
继续等高人。。。。another interesting thing about this book is like watching one of life's fallacies at work: make up one's mind, draw a conclusion, then look for evidence to support it. When something doesn't support this conclusion? hey, what the heck, I didn't see it, or it's a lie!
[此贴子已经被作者于2010/2/23 11:34:59编辑过]
Have no time to read, but am curious. What's your opinion?
好多人都推荐看电视，跟着电视念
我也有同样的问题，我记中文名字都不行，而且如果只是听到的就更不容易记住。
空空居然不是北京的？南方口音满重嘛
NOD
一个是，我在一个教堂的英语学校上课，每次就是聊天，什么都说，慢慢的，听说都提高了，而且不象应试学习考过就忘，这种方法，提高了以后就是自己的了。
NOD
我觉得说出来很重要，光听不说，很难全听懂，然后更难说出来。要是能一边听，一边说，跟着说也好，聊天也好，进步就特别快。
我有两个经验，一个是闺女小的时候看finding nemo，我们天天看，当背景声音，我基本上那部电影，半年里听了200遍，然后都能背下来了，再看其他动画片，就觉得特容易，
一个是，我在一个教堂的英语学校上课，每次就是聊天，什么都说，慢慢的，听说都提高了，而且不象应试学习考过就忘，这种方法，提高了以后就是自己的了。
挺有用的。
回去试试你的方法。
你们那里这么暖和？我也在德州，这下雪呢
今天我们这里也降温了，早上50几度，今天晚上30几度。
今天我们这里也降温了，早上50几度，今天晚上30几度。
下雪了没有？
下雪了没有？
我刚听瓶子说有小雪，阴天就很烦
我刚听瓶子说有小雪，阴天就很烦
你能看到吗？我在笼子里，窗户都没有
哈哈哈。
好奇一下，空空的好多想法是不是特符合你心目中的北京人？
i actually dont' know what beijingers are like....kongkong has the typical 既得利益阶层 in my mind, i.e. 肉糜。。。。。。至于为什么我把肉糜跟北京等同起来，我自己也满奇怪的。我根本也不认识几个北京孩子是这样的，而且我也没在北京读书过。
你能看到吗？我在笼子里，窗户都没有
没有下呢，就是阴天，而且感觉的到挺冷的
Have no time to read, but am curious. What's your opinion?
instinctively i feel "fallacy at work" but i dont have the brain/logic to point out exactly where she went amiss. need someone to point this out to me.....sigh
i actually dont' know what beijingers are like....kongkong has the typical 既得利益阶层 in my mind, i.e. 肉糜。。。。。。至于为什么我把肉糜跟北京等同起来，我自己也满奇怪的。我根本也不认识几个北京孩子是这样的，而且我也没在北京读书过。
。。。。。。。。。。。。。。。。
i actually dont' know what beijingers are like....kongkong has the typical 既得利益阶层 in my mind, i.e. 肉糜。。。。。。至于为什么我把肉糜跟北京等同起来，我自己也满奇怪的。我根本也不认识几个北京孩子是这样的，而且我也没在北京读书过。
Is Kongkong from Kuangdong? :P She has the 'free-mind' spirit which I don't always see in Beijingers...
i actually dont' know what beijingers are like....kongkong has the typical 既得利益阶层 in my mind, i.e. 肉糜。。。。。。至于为什么我把肉糜跟北京等同起来，我自己也满奇怪的。我根本也不认识几个北京孩子是这样的，而且我也没在北京读书过。
肉糜是啥引申含义，
没有下呢，就是阴天，而且感觉的到挺冷的
我一点都感觉不到。赛，跟小老鼠似的待在洞里
我一点都感觉不到。赛，跟小老鼠似的待在洞里
so cute
肉糜是啥引申含义，
就是何不食肉糜来的。自己出身于优越的背景，就无法理解其他人的disadvantaged situation的意思。不过这是我的理解only。
我一点都感觉不到。赛，跟小老鼠似的待在洞里
我其实也看不清楚外边，窗子上都是雾气
instinctively i feel "fallacy at work" but i dont have the brain/logic to point out exactly where she went amiss. need someone to point this out to me.....sigh
You mean, her 'fallacy at work' is misleading?
下雪了没有？
downtown没有。
You mean, her 'fallacy at work' is misleading?
谁要的。。。跟我dropbox连起来。。。。。。我听的肚子里一团气郁结了。比如她攻击walmart给工人条件很差，牺牲工人的一切来赢得利润。论据之一是，walmart 卖东西的人买不起walmart卖的东西。我马上就想，难道neman marcus /nordstorm (how to spell this?!) 的售货员一定买的起自己买的东西？豪华家具店呢？电子产品店呢？这个叫什么论据啊。另外说walmart报告说效率提高了，她说walmart is known to doctor its records anyway，意思是，通过谎报员工的工作时间来实现的。好么，人家报告里的数据，自己想用的就拿来用，自己不喜欢的就说是人家捏造的。。。。
就是何不食肉糜来的。自己出身于优越的背景，就无法理解其他人的disadvantaged situation的意思。不过这是我的理解only。
恩，从这个角度讲，很多北京人的优越感可以说成是肉糜含义的一小方面
就是何不食肉糜来的。自己出身于优越的背景，就无法理解其他人的disadvantaged situation的意思。不过这是我的理解only。
i really think it has nothing to do with so called "优越的背景", i am from a common family background. just my parents and my teachers never restricted me in any way shape of form. and i feel " 既得利益阶层 " very disturbing. I would like to ask you politely not to use that phrase on me. Every single step, i took conciously on my own, and i am one of the hardest working type of people i know of. I respect you worked very hard to get what you have today, but please also know that i come to who i am today with hard work as well. there is nobody really provided back doors to me, or give me special treatment, because i did not need them.
谁要的。。。跟我dropbox连起来。。。。。。我听的肚子里一团气郁结了。比如她攻击walmart给工人条件很差，牺牲工人的一切来赢得利润。论据之一是，walmart 卖东西的人买不起walmart卖的东西。我马上就想，难道neman marcus /nordstorm (how to spell this?!) 的售货员一定买的起自己买的东西？豪华家具店呢？电子产品店呢？这个叫什么论据啊。另外说walmart报告说效率提高了，她说walmart is known to doctor its records anyway，意思是，通过谎报员工的工作时间来实现的。好么，人家报告里的数据，自己想用的就拿来用，自己不喜欢的就说是人家捏造的。。。。
就沃尔玛这件事，她说的是沃尔玛的员工买不起“沃尔玛”的东西，而不是“工作的商店”的东西。是因为沃尔玛的东西便宜，连这里的东西都买不起，能买得起的东西就不多了吧。
。比如她攻击walmart给工人条件很差，牺牲工人的一切来赢得利润。论据之一是，walmart 卖东西的人买不起walmart卖的东西。我马上就想，难道neman marcus /nordstorm (how to spell this?!) 的售货员一定买的起自己买的东西？
谁要的。。。跟我dropbox连起来。。。。。。我听的肚子里一团气郁结了。比如她攻击walmart给工人条件很差，牺牲工人的一切来赢得利润。论据之一是，walmart 卖东西的人买不起walmart卖的东西。我马上就想，难道neman marcus /nordstorm (how to spell this?!) 的售货员一定买的起自己买的东西？豪华家具店呢？电子产品店呢？这个叫什么论据啊。另外说walmart报告说效率提高了，她说walmart is known to doctor its records anyway，意思是，通过谎报员工的工作时间来实现的。好么，人家报告里的数据，自己想用的就拿来用，自己不喜欢的就说是人家捏造的。。。。
Acturally, from what u descirbed in the previous 2 posts about her, I have this feeling that she's just one of those idealists--rush to the ideal conclusion without much scientific proof and sound reserach--typical democrats... :P
i really think it has nothing to do with so called "优越的背景", i am from a common family background. just my parents and my teachers never restricted me in any way shape of form. and i feel " 既得利益阶层 " very disturbing. I would like to ask you politely not to use that phrase on me. Every single step, i took conciously on my own, and i am one of the hardest working type of people i know of. I respect you worked very hard to get what you have today, but please also know that i come to who i am today with hard work as well. there is nobody really provided back doors to me, or give me special treatment, because i did not need them.
太激动了吧，我在解释肉糜这个词在古语里面的意思。i.e. 皇帝这个既得利益阶层不懂民生疾苦。
太激动了吧，我在解释肉糜这个词在古语里面的意思。i.e. 皇帝这个既得利益阶层不懂民生疾苦。
if i misunderstood, then I apologize.
i may have less obstacles than you in China, but our grounds are leveled that we are all in US now..
and i am in disadvantage now as I can not type chinese and my english is really not good.
if i misunderstood, then I apologize.
i may have less obstacles than you in China, but our grounds are leveled that we are all in US now..
and i am in disadvantage now as I can not type chinese and my english is really not good.
i really think it has nothing to do with so called "优越的背景", i am from a common family background. just my parents and my teachers never restricted me in any way shape of form. and i feel " 既得利益阶层 " very disturbing. I would like to ask you politely not to use that phrase on me. Every single step, i took conciously on my own, and i am one of the hardest working type of people i know of. I respect you worked very hard to get what you have today, but please also know that i come to who i am today with hard work as well. there is nobody really provided back doors to me, or give me special treatment, because i did not need them.
Kongkong, I have to say, it's very starnge to me that all your teachers did not restrict you in any form. One is fine, but hard to understand none of them did. :P
Acturally, from what u descirbed in the previous 2 posts about her, I have this feeling that she's just one of those idealists--rush to the ideal conclusion without much scientific proof and sound reserach--typical democrats... :P
这个作者，很另人佩服的亲身参与了她写作的research。比如她写nickel and dime就亲身成为挣minimum wage的一员这样去过了好几个月。她写bait and switch的时候也作为白领失业者一员去试图找了几个月工作。前者我没看，不知道。bait and switch我看了，不过她找工作的approach跟我预想的有很大的差距。读了之后禁不住要想，世界到底要如何？大家全都不同工但是要同筹么？
这个作者，很另人佩服的亲身参与了她写作的research。比如她写nickel and dime就亲身成为挣minimum wage的一员这样去过了好几个月。她写bait and switch的时候也作为白领失业者一员去试图找了几个月工作。前者我没看，不知道。bait and switch我看了，不过她找工作的approach跟我预想的有很大的差距。读了之后禁不住要想，世界到底要如何？大家全都不同工但是要同筹么？
Experience does not mean research. What she sees may not be the whole truth. That's why I feel she huaren.us into her conclusion. And, I'm always again this type of ideal socialism. History proved it didn't work.
Kongkong, I have to say, it's very starnge to me that all your teachers did not restrict you in any form. One is fine, but hard to understand none of them did. :P
what can i say, i am lucky. (actually in elementary school my last few years not so, but it did not affect me much for some reason).. all my other major teachers (ban zhu ren) really allow me thrive, my middle school both are math teachers, so i guess we hit it off...
i am serious i am really frustrated now.. i still could not fix it... i may have to restart the computer
"this land is their land"还有一个例子说genentech给员工巨好的福利。但是他们的onsite subsidized cafeteria, which is subcontracted via this kind of firms, of course, offers extremely poor working conditions and benefits to its employees. then there's fight, media exposure etc between the cafeteria employees and the employers. 然后作者非常义愤填膺genentech居然对此不做什么表示。COME ON，这样的情况要genentech怎么表示吧？切断跟食物供应公司的合同，自己开一个食物供应公司，并且给这个cafeteria worker全部加scientist的头衔和待遇？
butt决定脑袋
什么样的理论都必然有它的市场。
what can i say, i am lucky. (actually in elementary school my last few years not so, but it did not affect me much for some reason).. all my other major teachers (ban zhu ren) really allow me thrive, my middle school both are math teachers, so i guess we hit it off...
See, I'm curious about that 'some reason'. I guess it was really your dad's attitude helped a lot. So you didn't really care about those who tried to shape you.
Experience does not mean research. What she sees may not be the whole truth. That's why I feel she huaren.us into her conclusion. And, I'm always again this type of ideal socialism. History proved it didn't work.
i agree. to look for a job with a researching mind is completely different experience. it is just like paper stock transaction. it means nothing
if i misunderstood, then I apologize.
i may have less obstacles than you in China, but our grounds are leveled that we are all in US now..
and i am in disadvantage now as I can not type chinese and my english is really not good.
btw, i can type chinese now, but I wrote in English in order to show that we are in the same ground
"this land is their land"还有一个例子说genentech给员工巨好的福利。但是他们的onsite subsidized cafeteria, which is subcontracted via this kind of firms, of course, offers extremely poor working conditions and benefits to its employees. then there's fight, media exposure etc between the cafeteria employees and the employers. 然后作者非常义愤填膺genentech居然对此不做什么表示。COME ON，这样的情况要genentech怎么表示吧？切断跟食物供应公司的合同，自己开一个食物供应公司，并且给这个cafeteria worker全部加scientist的头衔和待遇？
If there's a problem within the company, the company is responsible to solve the problem. Anyway, it's just a common issue of management.
btw, i can type chinese now, but I wrote in English in order to show that we are in the same ground
although i'd like to
If there's a problem within the company, the company is responsible to solve the problem. Anyway, it's just a common issue of management.
食物供应公司的确需要solve....可是genentech作为客户，为什么一定需要做表示。。。。
butt决定脑袋
什么样的理论都必然有它的市场。
Interest 决定脑袋
Whatever theory that meets the interest of some will be supported.
although i'd like to
肉糜是啥引申含义，
包子的反义词，处处是晋惠帝名言“何不食肉糜”
这个作者最喜欢批评资本家用完一个人的价值就把人扔一边的做法。比如随意fire员工。举的正面例子是ford，henry ford说，如果我工厂里造汽车的工人都买不起他们造的汽车，那我就不成功，blabla类似的话。后来ford还是lay off人了，于是作者又义愤填膺啊。当时书似乎是０７年写的。不知道她看到现在的三大又有什么看法。
Hehe, it really makes me wonder the author was just looking for some mass market for herself to publish... I won't read her books. :P
包子的反义词，处处是晋惠帝名言“何不食肉糜”
刚才kp 给我kp 了出处
但是为啥和包子反义呢，包子不是人太面，太被人欺负吗
Interest 决定脑袋
Whatever theory that meets the interest of some will be supported.
我超级需要知道，世界到底应该如何work.......穷人很穷，是很可怜啊，但是怎么解决呢？从CEO身上挂油下来分给领foodstamps的人，给他们饭吃，给他们衣服穿，给他们universal health care?
我超级需要知道，世界到底应该如何work.......穷人很穷，是很可怜啊，但是怎么解决呢？从CEO身上挂油下来分给领foodstamps的人，给他们饭吃，给他们衣服穿，给他们universal health care?
穷人当然会这么想呀，哈哈
包子的反义词，处处是晋惠帝名言“何不食肉糜”
no no no . 肉糜!=!包子
little monkey like this does the trick
刚才kp 给我kp 了出处
但是为啥和包子反义呢，包子不是人太面，太被人欺负吗
haha, you said it
食物供应公司的确需要solve....可是genentech作为客户，为什么一定需要做表示。。。。
Genentech contract the cafe to the food supplier, who is considered the representative of the real customers (workers). If the service was terrible, the representative is responsible to speak for the customers and revise the contract.
刚才kp 给我kp 了出处
但是为啥和包子反义呢，包子不是人太面，太被人欺负吗
我的理解是肉糜心里强大不会被人欺负，所以是被人欺负的包子的反义词呀。
no no no . 肉糜!=!包子
啊？!=! 啥意思？
no no no . 肉糜!=!包子
啊？!=! 啥意思？
"肉糜" not equal to "not 包子"
我超级需要知道，世界到底应该如何work.......穷人很穷，是很可怜啊，但是怎么解决呢？从CEO身上挂油下来分给领foodstamps的人，给他们饭吃，给他们衣服穿，给他们universal health care?
My, you're considering this BIG question. So far, there's no genius ever come up with a single solution. :) I believe the world works by itself, bit by bit improving... The poor needs to work out the solution for themselves, just like we immigrants need to find our way out. So far education seems the best way to help.
no no no . 肉糜!=!包子
!=!
这是什么符合？
"肉糜" not equal to "not 包子"
"肉糜" not equal to "not 包子"
Genentech contract the cafe to the food supplier, who is considered the representative of the real customers (workers). If the service was terrible, the representative is responsible to speak for the customers and revise the contract.
没看懂“if service is terrible"是什么意思，genentech接受的服务是很好的。作者意思是dish out food的工人工作条件比较差。这样的情况下genentech的责任是什么呢？
My, you're considering this BIG question. So far, there's no genius ever come up with a single solution. :) I believe the world works by itself, bit by bit improving... The poor needs to work out the solution for themselves, just like we immigrants need to find our way out. So far education seems the best way to help.
教育也被作者攻击了哈哈。说大学学费是so so 贵啊，学出来也找不到工作啊。。。。。。。。这个在中国还真是的呢。美国不知道。这个要怎么解决？
我超级需要知道，世界到底应该如何work.......穷人很穷，是很可怜啊，但是怎么解决呢？从CEO身上挂油下来分给领foodstamps的人，给他们饭吃，给他们衣服穿，给他们universal health care?
这个世界不是单纯简单的。所以我都不想。
我的理解是肉糜心里强大不会被人欺负，所以是被人欺负的包子的反义词呀。
不完全是。不过在某些情况下，是
没看懂“if service is terrible"是什么意思，genentech接受的服务是很好的。作者意思是dish out food的工人工作条件比较差。这样的情况下genentech的责任是什么呢？
那个作者的意思是genetech应该对那个餐饮公司抗议，你不对你的员工好点，我就不跟你续contract了。
其实我觉得你不用较真，不同意她的观点就不要看了。
那个作者的意思是genetech应该对那个餐饮公司抗议，你不对你的员工好点，我就不跟你续contract了。
其实我觉得你不用较真，不同意她的观点就不要看了。
我也是拿了个假想敌，攻击人家obviously ridiculous的部分来验证自己的论点那。。。。。
[此贴子已经被作者于2010/2/23 14:05:08编辑过]
没看懂“if service is terrible"是什么意思，genentech接受的服务是很好的。作者意思是dish out food的工人工作条件比较差。这样的情况下genentech的责任是什么呢？
Hehe, I thought the cafe was terrible--which happens in where I'm now... Now I see that the author's point. I guess it's like protesting products made by children--not so extreme though. ;P
今天。。。。。。。罗嗦上了哈。"bait and switch" 上次我好像也说过。讲作者隐姓埋名，假装是一个独立工作很久，想找corporate里面固定工作的人。她要找做PR的工作，在各种career coach, networking event和seminar上浪费了大量金钱后，９个月都没有找到一份工作，最后放弃了。这些人的displacement的确是个社会问题，这些人年纪不老小，又没啥特殊skill，当世界as a whole need your skillset的时候就有工作，世界不需要那么多成天出来磨嘴皮子的人的时候，这些白领就没工作呗。还要怎样吧。。。。。真的只有blame社会这一条路？
She can be a lobbyist to ask for government intervention to support people like her... :P
我心理出现两个相互有部分交集的集合，同时他们的外部还有广阔的空间
我也是拿了个假想敌，攻击人家obviously ridiculous的部分来验证自己的论点那。。。。。
I don't understand why you need this 假想敌?
She can be a lobbyist to ask for government intervention to support people like her... :P
sigh 她也说了应该去hire lobbist 为umemployed白领争取福利。关键，关键，我脑海里面对社会应当如何这个问题没有确切的答案，blame the poor for being poor 就是典型肉糜思想了－－我承认在这个问题上我还是很肉糜的，我就是不明白这些人的entitlement 感觉是哪里来的，为什么认为the world owns them a living no matter what。。。。。。。。
I don't understand why you need this 假想敌?
我就是不明白应该如何理解看见的这些现象。作者跟我看见的很多现象是一样，但是理解完全不一样。我需要一直在心里辩论就是因为我自己也不知道应该怎么来理解。
CEO们拿钱太多这个问题John Bogle也说过的嘛。（Enough一书)，说大家给 ceo定工资的标准是，看这个ceo的工资在类似 ceo的工资pool里面站在大约什么百分比的地方。如果在lower quartile就往上调。直接结果就是水涨船高。在这个问题上我跟领foodstamps的穷人们一起眼红啊。。。。。。。。怎么看呢？
[此贴子已经被作者于2010/2/23 14:05:08编辑过]
Apparently, 水涨船高 is the problem. CEO's salary probably should not be determined this way, rather, more connected with the performance.
Apparently, 水涨船高 is the problem. CEO's salary probably should not be determined this way, rather, more connected with the performance.
但是谁有权力去禁止他们这样做呢？
sigh 她也说了应该去hire lobbist 为umemployed白领争取福利。关键，关键，我脑海里面对社会应当如何这个问题没有确切的答案，blame the poor for being poor 就是典型肉糜思想了－－我承认在这个问题上我还是很肉糜的，我就是不明白这些人的entitlement 感觉是哪里来的，为什么认为the world owns them a living no matter what。。。。。。。。
Is it funny that from a socialism country, most of us get this idea--blame the poor for being poor; while in the richest capitalism country, the poor gets their entitlement. :) See, that's why I feel education is important. :P
我就是不明白应该如何理解看见的这些现象。作者跟我看见的很多现象是一样，但是理解完全不一样。我需要一直在心里辩论就是因为我自己也不知道应该怎么来理解。
We have different self-history and different interests. There's never a single answer to all.
Hehe, I feel you are always looking for some standard answer. Like how you don't understand enen's words because of your more strict rules on grammar. :)