BBC presenter Mark Urban：Wang Wen is the Executive Dean of the Chongyang Institute for Financial Studies in Beijing, joins us bright and early in the morning there, and an advisor to the Chinese government as well. Welcome to you. Dr. Wang, are we going to see Beijing following Shanghai and Hong Kong and so many other Chinese cities into one of these long strict lockdowns?Wang Wen: Actually, I think now you may have a little bit overestimated the Beijing’s pandemic, because this week only 100 cases were confirmed in Beijing. In the past two years, Beijing has experienced at least four waves of recurrence of the pandemic, but all of them have been experienced. But we all know that Omicron now is much more serious than before. Although a few people complain, most people believe in the government and willing to cooperate with the government's anti-pandemic policy. Now, some houses and streets in Beijing have taken control measures and test nucleic acid every day, but most areas are still normal! The anti-pandemic ability of Chinese cities is becoming stronger and stronger. You know, China has 1.4 billion people, which is much more than all 30 countries of the west, but in the past two years, the death toll of Covid in China is only less than 1% of that in the West. So, I don't think Beijing will be locked down.BBC presenter Mark Urban：Dr. Wang, do you think that China can keep going with a Zero Covid policy that it's practiced up tonow?Wang Wen：I think in the latest two years, in the west, more than 2 million people died in Covid-19, most of them are poor people and old people. So, you can see in China, the Zero Covid policy is actually to be more beneficial to the poor and the elderly. In order to protect the poor and the old, China does not hesitate to sacrifice economic growth. This is my point.BBC presenter Mark Urban：It's going to be some difficult decisions to be made if the Party Congress will be protected from the prospect of either being delayed or disrupted by an outbreak in Beijing?Wang Wen: Mark, I know you used to be a war correspondent. But you may not know that in China, we compare the anti-pandemic as a war. The virus is our enemy. In this anti-pandemic war, China is the best country in the world in the past two years, protect people's lives, export the most masks and medical machine to the world, and contribute to the recovery of the world economy. And so- called Party Congress I think that in the west, maybe there are some misunderstandings about the Communist Party of China……BBC presenter Mark Urban：Can I……Wang Wen:
But in China,about the Congress,the people support the Communist Party and love their leader. This is from our heart.
BBC presenter Mark Urban：Can I follow……Wang Wen: That’s why I think this autumn, China will have a very successful National Congress.BBC presenter Mark Urban：Can I follow up as you did for the war analogy? And indeed, I think a lot of western countries would have looked at China's record up tonow and said they've been very successful in containing outbreaks. But the question that I think a lot of Westerners would ask was, why didn't you use the time that brought you to conduct mass vaccination?Wang Wen:
Actually, I think that we love life for most of Chinese people. We are unwilling to take risks for the so-called "freedom", which is the fundamental reason why we have confidence in finance and economy. Some people in the west misunderstand China.
BBC presenter Mark Urban：Sorry…Wang Wen:
But we should have confidence to China’s future.
BBC presenter Mark Urban：Thank you very much Dr. Wang Wen, thank you very much for joining us.
编者按：4月28日，在就俄乌冲突接受BBC专访并引起国内外广泛关注后，中国人民大学重阳金融研究院执行院长王文再次接受英国广播公司（BBC）著名主持人马克·厄本的专访，就疫情是否影响北京运行等问题做了回答，其间马克多次打断王文的正面阐述。该视频在国内外广泛传播。现将视频现场、对话文字稿展现如下：点击播放键观看视频↓
以下为BBC直播对话文字稿实录
BBC主持人马克·厄本：王文是中国人民大学重阳金融研究院执行院长，他参与过中国政府的咨询工作，感谢王院长在北京的清晨来节目连线。王文教授，北京会是继上海、香港和中国其他许多城市之后，进行长期严格封锁的城市吗?
王文：
事实上，你可能过度评估了这一波北京疫情。北京这周才确诊100例。过去两年，北京经历了至少4波疫情复发，但都很有经验地度过。当然，奥密克戎更严重一些。尽管少数人有抱怨，但绝大多数人都相信政府, 愿意配合政府的抗疫政策。现在，北京部分住宅、街道采取了管控措施，每天核酸检测，但大多数区域仍然是正常！中国城市的抗疫能力越来越强。你知道，中国有14亿人，这比整个西方所有30个国家相加还得多，但在中国因新冠病毒死亡的人数却不到西方的1%。我认为，北京不会被封城。
BBC主持人马克·厄本：王文教授，你认为中国能继续实行当前的“清零政策”吗? 王文：过去两年，在西方，超过200万人死于新冠，绝大多数都是穷人和老人。中国“动态清零”政策，本质上看是更有利于保护穷人与老人的生命。中国为保护弱者，不惜牺牲一些经济增长。这是我的看法。BBC主持人马克·厄本：如果党代会不会因为北京疫情而被推迟或中断，北京封城将是一个艰难的决定?
王文：
马克，你曾当过战地记者。但你可能不知道，在中国，我们把抗疫比作是一场战争。病毒就是我们的敌人。综合来看，这场战争，过去两年，中国仍是全世界打得最好的国家，保护了人民的生命，向世界出口最多的口罩、医疗机械，贡献了世界经济复苏。至于党代会，我知道，在西方，总有人对中国共产党有歪曲……BBC主持人马克·厄本：我要打断一下……
王文：
但是，在中国，至于党代会，你知道，中国人民拥护共产党，热爱国家领袖。这是发自内心的。
BBC主持人马克·厄本：
我想问一下……
王文：
所以我认为今年秋天，中国共产党第二十次全国代表大会一定会很成功！
BBC主持人马克·厄本：
我可以接着你作的战争类比往下说吗？确实，我认为很多西方国家会看到中国到目前为止的抗疫历程，并认为他们在防控疫情方面非常成功。但我想很多西方人会问的问题是，中国为什么不利用这段时间来进行大规模的疫苗接种?
王文：
其实上，大多数中国人已疫苗接种并很“惜命”，只是不愿意为所谓“自由”而过度冒险。这正是我们对长期的金融、经济发展有信心的根本原因。西方一些人误解中国……
BBC主持人马克·厄本：
抱歉……
王文：
所以我们应该对中国的未来有信心。
BBC主持人马克·厄本：
非常感谢王文教授参加我们的节目。
以下为英文版
BBC interview
By Wang Wen
BBC presenter Mark Urban：Wang Wen is the Executive Dean of the Chongyang Institute for Financial Studies in Beijing, joins us bright and early in the morning there, and an advisor to the Chinese government as well. Welcome to you. Dr. Wang, are we going to see Beijing following Shanghai and Hong Kong and so many other Chinese cities into one of these long strict lockdowns?Wang Wen: Actually, I think now you may have a little bit overestimated the Beijing’s pandemic, because this week only 100 cases were confirmed in Beijing. In the past two years, Beijing has experienced at least four waves of recurrence of the pandemic, but all of them have been experienced. But we all know that Omicron now is much more serious than before. Although a few people complain, most people believe in the government and willing to cooperate with the government's anti-pandemic policy. Now, some houses and streets in Beijing have taken control measures and test nucleic acid every day, but most areas are still normal! The anti-pandemic ability of Chinese cities is becoming stronger and stronger. You know, China has 1.4 billion people, which is much more than all 30 countries of the west, but in the past two years, the death toll of Covid in China is only less than 1% of that in the West. So, I don't think Beijing will be locked down.BBC presenter Mark Urban：Dr. Wang, do you think that China can keep going with a Zero Covid policy that it's practiced up tonow?Wang Wen：I think in the latest two years, in the west, more than 2 million people died in Covid-19, most of them are poor people and old people. So, you can see in China, the Zero Covid policy is actually to be more beneficial to the poor and the elderly. In order to protect the poor and the old, China does not hesitate to sacrifice economic growth. This is my point.BBC presenter Mark Urban：It's going to be some difficult decisions to be made if the Party Congress will be protected from the prospect of either being delayed or disrupted by an outbreak in Beijing?Wang Wen: Mark, I know you used to be a war correspondent. But you may not know that in China, we compare the anti-pandemic as a war. The virus is our enemy. In this anti-pandemic war, China is the best country in the world in the past two years, protect people's lives, export the most masks and medical machine to the world, and contribute to the recovery of the world economy. And so- called Party Congress I think that in the west, maybe there are some misunderstandings about the Communist Party of China……BBC presenter Mark Urban：Can I……Wang Wen:
But in China,about the Congress,the people support the Communist Party and love their leader. This is from our heart.
BBC presenter Mark Urban：Can I follow……Wang Wen: That’s why I think this autumn, China will have a very successful National Congress.BBC presenter Mark Urban：Can I follow up as you did for the war analogy? And indeed, I think a lot of western countries would have looked at China's record up tonow and said they've been very successful in containing outbreaks. But the question that I think a lot of Westerners would ask was, why didn't you use the time that brought you to conduct mass vaccination?Wang Wen:
Actually, I think that we love life for most of Chinese people. We are unwilling to take risks for the so-called "freedom", which is the fundamental reason why we have confidence in finance and economy. Some people in the west misunderstand China.
BBC presenter Mark Urban：Sorry…Wang Wen:
But we should have confidence to China’s future.
BBC presenter Mark Urban：Thank you very much Dr. Wang Wen, thank you very much for joining us.